Joseph only married married women for a loophole

[_souldier]

Okay, reread the Kirtland polygamy essay and something new stood out to me.

He may have believed that sealings to married women would comply with the Lord’s command without requiring him to have normal marriage relationships.33 This could explain why, according to Lorenzo Snow, the angel reprimanded Joseph for having “demurred” on plural marriage even after he had entered into the practice.34 After this rebuke, according to this interpretation, Joseph returned primarily to sealings with single women.

Since Snow was oh so honest during the Temple Lot case mentioned here, my b***s*** alarm was ringing like crazy after reading that statement. I don't know the history as well, but how blatantly obvious is this lie? I believe he married 11 currently married women, but I don't know the dates. Who was his last polyandrous wife?

[_Brackite]

Who was his last polyandrous wife?

Elvira Cowles Holmes - Link

[_souldier]

Thanks for the link. So a year before his *cough*martyrdom*cough*, the Lord finally told him to stop marrying other men's wives. Well, that took a while. You would think that God would stop telling him to use the "loophole" after his first, maybe second, time. But I guess He was more worried about him getting married and getting more tail.

[_Zadok]

As long as we are just speculating.... Perhaps Joseph was growing tired of second-hand brides, and found banging the babysitters to be more sexually satisfying. It certainly was easier to keep the kids quiet. While those old married women would talk up a storm around the general mercantile in Nauvoo.

[_Mormonicious]

Of interesting note is the change to the tone of the Nauvoo bell.

When Horny Holy Joe was alive the tone of the Nauvoo bell was a very distinct Bang!

Noticeably the Nauvoo bell would ring on three distinct occasions.

First as a time keeper, on the hour and half hour corresponding to the time (i.e. three times for 3 o'clock, once for 3:30, four times for 4 o'clock, etc.).

Second as a notice of importance to the community, such as fire fighting, town meetings, church meetings, etc.

And little known, every time Horny Holy Joe banged a women other than Emma.

After his death it was noted that the tone of the bell changed to the Bong we are familiar with today.

Bang, bang, bang-ity-bang, a bang, bang, bang-ity-bang, I say bang, bang, bang-ity-bang

[_grindael]

Okay, reread the Kirtland polygamy essay and something new stood out to me.

He may have believed that sealings to married women would comply with the Lord’s command without requiring him to have normal marriage relationships.33 This could explain why, according to Lorenzo Snow, the angel reprimanded Joseph for having “demurred” on plural marriage even after he had entered into the practice.34 After this rebuke, according to this interpretation, Joseph returned primarily to sealings with single women.

Since Snow was oh so honest during the Temple Lot case mentioned here, my b***s*** alarm was ringing like crazy after reading that statement. I don't know the history as well, but how blatantly obvious is this lie? I believe he married 11 currently married women, but I don't know the dates. Who was his last polyandrous wife?

Hmmm. This is assuming that all of those "marriages" were non-sexual. Wishful thinking. Dan Vogel wrote back in 2013 to Brian Hales,

The same degree of probability that compels you to admit sexual polyandry in three cases also exists for all the other marriages in this category. You state: “Yet, documentation of sexual relations with the legal husband during the same period is absent.” Why should this matter if Joseph Smith didn’t respect legal marriage, as you have argued?

“Accordingly, if Joseph Smith engaged in sexual polyandry, he was either a hypocrite, contradicting his own teachings, or he had found a loophole.” The majority of the polyandrous marriages occurred before the July 1843 revelation; so if he contradicted his teachings, it was retroactively. For those who think Joseph Smith was a pious deceiver, as I do, the idea that he contradicted his teachings is no problem. Of course, you are aiming at Mormons who assume a prophet can’t make mistakes. Two months before dictating D&C 132, Joseph Smith said: “I do not want you to think I am very righteous, for I am not” (DHC 5:401). One thing about Joseph Smith is that he was constantly repenting. So what you see as contradiction, I see as repentance. That’s my position.

(3) Of the twenty-three marriages for which you can’t document sexual relations, you say that there is no way to know which marriages were for “time and eternity” or “eternity only”. I have already said that you are making a hasty generalization based on an exceptional case. The “eternity only” marriage was suggested to Joseph Smith by the non-Mormon husband who didn’t believe in an afterlife. Obviously to him it wasn’t a serious proposal but a novelty and not necessarily a reflection of Joseph Smith’s teachings.

You admit Joseph Smith had sex with three of his polyandrous wives, but argue that the remaining eleven are matters of speculation. But you think you are justified in assuming that all eleven were “eternity only” marriages because the critics can’t prove Joseph Smith had sex with them. As I have already pointed out, your position is an argumentum ad ignorantiam. Moreover, I don’t believe you have sufficient grounds to assume such a category existed let alone it’s near universal application in the polyandry category. Why is it that the critics are speculating when they assume sexual polyandry but you aren’t when you assert that there was a wide practice of “eternity only” marriages by Joseph Smith and that all (except three) polyandrous marriages were of this type? Why aren’t you arguing the evidence in the Ruth Vose Sayers example is ambiguous or unclear? Indeed, upon what authority does Jenson’s note rest? It seems to me you are engaged in wishful thinking on an extraordinary level.

[_grindael]

Angel in 1834?: C'mon Jo, get with it. (Puts hand on sword and raises eyebrows)

Angel in 1842?: Dammit Jo, I said, get with it. (Draws sword and threatens death)

Angel in 1843?: Not that way Jo, it's got to be VIRGINS, and you have to have sex! Don't make me come back. (Rattles sword in scabbard with a mean look)

They're going with this? Really? Who wrote this crap?

[_badseed]

If one accepts the reasons the Laws gave for their publishing the Nauvoo Expositior, then Joseph was pursuing polyandrous wives a mere 6-7 months before Carthage. Looks like he proposed to Jane Law, Nov-Dec 1843.

[_Zadok]

As Brian Hales says, it is difficult to know exactly what was going on in Nauvoo, because the records regarding sexual encounters is rather sparse. Based on that, Hales then goes on to assume the least damning scenario and whitewashing the actions of Joseph Smith.

But equally possible is the dark side. Which is that Joseph was a very horny megalomaniac trying to bed every woman in Nauvoo. We don't have his old headboard, but I'll bet there were a lot more notches than we know about.