"Joseph" and "the Nephite record"

[_Blixa]

It's a trendy little apologist buzzphrase. Belongs in the bin with Ponderize.

Personally, I prefer Little Joe and Big Brig, but I get complaints when I post them here.

Big Brig? Old Boss. Prefer contemporary epithets : )

But back to the OP and "the nephite record."

SP, I don't read a lot of online "apologetic" stuff and so haven't really run into the phrase except a few times here (and I'm not here all that much, really). So, is it a current and widespread phrase? Anyone who can clue me in, thanks.

[_Runtu]

If you ever refer to him as "Smith," people get mightily offended. I don't quite understand why.

[_Fence Sitter]

If you ever refer to him as "Smith," people get mightily offended. I don't quite understand why.

Same thing if someone calls him Joe.

[_sock puppet]

It's a trendy little apologist buzzphrase. Belongs in the bin with Ponderize.

Personally, I prefer Little Joe and Big Brig, but I get complaints when I post them here.

Big Brig? Old Boss. Prefer contemporary epithets : )

But back to the OP and "the nephite record."

SP, I don't read a lot of online "apologetic" stuff and so haven't really run into the phrase except a few times here (and I'm not here all that much, really). So, is it a current and widespread phrase? Anyone who can clue me in, thanks.[/quote]
[quote="Blixa"]I'm seeing it pop up in the past two years quite a bit. Widespread? I can only tell you it is growing in my exposure to LDS, fragmented as it is. I heard it at a F&T meeting I was at for a baby blessing (great niece being blessed) and then a couple of times at a missionary farewell this past fall, like "I know the Book of Mormon is true, it is the Nephite record" or no mention of Book of Mormon except as "the Nephite record". And then I've seen it used more and more online too.

[_Fence Sitter]

Observation: Of the two trendy LDS catch phrases in the title of this thread, I thought that "the Nephite record" would elicit a greater response and more visceral reaction from TBMs. After all, it has implications for the truth claims of the LDS church, whereas referring to JSJr as "Joseph" is simply being cheeky--yet that is what TBM posters here have chosen to get their dander up about?

I suspect SP, (can I call you SP?) that the reason more people are complaining about "Joseph" than "the Nephite record" is the lack of any Lamanites to complain.

Hard to offend people who don't actually exist.

[_Blixa]

I'm seeing it pop up in the past two years quite a bit. Widespread? I can only tell you it is growing in my exposure to LDS, fragmented as it is. I heard it at a F&T meeting I was at for a baby blessing (great niece being blessed) and then a couple of times at a missionary farewell this past fall, like "I know the Book of Mormon is true, it is the Nephite record" or no mention of Book of Mormon except as "the Nephite record". And then I've seen it used more and more online too.

.


Interesting.

[_SuperDell]

Before David O. McKay the top dog was referred to as the President of the Church. "The Prophet" was Joseph Smith.
Some started calling Pres McKay "prophet" and he didn't discourage it. That trend has only gotten worse since his time even though few prophesies have come from those referred to by that title.

[Guest]

Do you refer to Monson as Thomas? If not, why not? You both believe in the LDS truth claims; doesn't that give you an affinity and familiarity with one another to put you on first name only basis

If he even knew who I was (I once sat within arm reach of him), he would be quite welcome to refer to me by first name. I wouldn't feel comfortable doing the same because I don't (yet?) relate to him on the same level as I do some others.

My OP and point is that it is a current fad among many LDS. Were you doing it before it became vogue among LDS to speak of this man none have ever met as if they are close, intimate acquaintances.

I don't know when it became "vogue", if it can be called that. But much of the Restoration-themed music I listened to since my teenage years referred to Joseph (and Hyrum) by first name only.

Your experience is sobering. Do you refer to Nelson Mandela as "Nelson" and Alexander Solzhenitsyn as "Alexander"?

No. But if I carefully studied their lives and their writings, and if such things resonated with me to the point that I felt I really new them, then yes, I might start doing so. I'll provide two examples that are less dramatic. David Archuleta and Kelly Clarskon are two people whose growth I have followed over the years, thoroughly enjoying their talent, the resonating/important messages they sing, and their gracious/humble demeanor. I feel a distinct rapport with them, and refer to them by first name...something which even my kids think is out of place. Feel free to join them in their disapproval. :0)

I don't think your harrowing experience makes you arrogant or presumptuous, just your calling someone you never personally knew but is a historical figure, particularly in your religion, by first name only is.

If you want to ratchet up things that you think are presumptuous, the assertion that I never personally knew Joseph is merely that...an assertion.

[Guest]

Given the topic, the more relevant question would be when hagoth7 started calling Joseph Smith 'Joseph.'

Based on the experience he described and his resulting empathy toward Joseph Smith, he would have started then or shortly thereafter, right?

Or did you start roughly when the fad started? And like so many Mormons trying to rationalize, you connected the fad with your story ex post facto?

As I mentioned above, the music I listened to in my teens and twenties referred to Joseph by first name.

However, to answer your question more directly, I don't remember when I actually started verbalizing/writing the same...whether it preceded the music, came shortly after, or came long after.

[_hagoth7]

...whereas referring to JSJr as "Joseph" is simply being cheeky--yet that is what TBM posters here have chosen to get their dander up about?

? Whose dander is up?

Again, I think there's nothing cheeky about calling someone you feel kinship with by first name. As to getting cheeky, my nickname for decades was "Cheeks", so if you ever want to drop the politically-correct formalities, you are quite free to refer to me that way or by my first name. The former would probably make me chuckle. The latter would probably just make me smile.