DiscussMormonism.com

Polygamy-Porter wrote:Oh reely fence sitter??

It's far more complicated than that.

How far would this new and improved Mormon President DB go with that?

Would he allow legally gay couples full membership? Even being sealed in the temple??

Would he allow women to be priesthood holders?

Would he call women to be bishops, stake presidents, and even Apostles???

Would he allow unwed fornicating couples to have full membership?

Would he allow members to give talk on how they oppose certain portions of the theology?

The list is as long as the day.

DBMORMON wrote:have you ever been institutionalized? I can't imagine finding someone as aggressive as you out in the dark dreary world and getting along

Funny you would ask me that.

No, never.

You?

DBMORMON wrote:gays sealed.... hmmm. i am open to it. Would love to have the conversation with God if I was in charge and see what his reasons are for not doing so.

I would certainly seek ways to be more gender equal.... not sure what that would mean.

Women at top levels.... I am open to having a conversation

unwed fornicators..... are they kinder then you? do they allow you full fellowship? i mean being an ass seems much worse.

I would allow members to talk more about perspectives where it is outside the doctrine of Christ.

Are you publicaly advocating drastic changes to the current standards and theology of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

Hi Bill. Have you been threatened with church discipline yet? What is your current status?

Talk about sophisticated, that site has its own T-shirts. Ponderific!

cwald wrote:Hi Bill. Have you been threatened with church discipline yet? What is your current status?

so far nothing. I am active. Go every week. have a calling. have a recommend. My bishop did sit down with me because some members were reporting to him I was making them uncomfortable but that he felt there needed to be room for nuanced believers.

DBMORMON wrote:

cwald wrote:Hi Bill. Have you been threatened with church discipline yet? What is your current status?

so far nothing. I am active. Go every week. have a calling. have a recommend. My bishop did sit down with me because some members were reporting to him I was making them uncomfortable but that he felt there needed to be room for nuanced believers.

You heard it here first folks!

Nuanced Mormons.

Move over NOMs, NMs just came to town!

consiglieri wrote:

Mary wrote:
Why doesn't someone actually ask Bill? His site has been going for a good while and it is a pay to listen on many discussions.

Bill is a good guy who is not scared of questioning his own religion.

And he doesn't have a lot of patience with apologetics as usual.

Which is why he sometimes gets crosswise with Scott Gordon.

Bill's main goal is to follow the truth, wherever it may lead him.

I have a lot of respect for him.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I have seen some of the conversations between Bill and Scott. He frustrates because he is not only right..he is so damn nice when he does it. Bill is always willing to answer my own questions and for that..he is one of my heroes...you, too Consig!

I came down hard on Bill when I first saw him on the nom board.

I gained a lot of respect for him when he took a very hard public stance over the children of gays policy.

Also he should get some respect for his trying to work with FairMormon in bringing some liberal views to their flock, and even more for his expulsion and erasure from say organization.

If he supplements his income via the hard work he obviously puts into this, so be it.

Polygamy-Porter wrote:You heard it here first folks!

Nuanced Mormons.

Move over NOMs, NMs just came to town!

Yeah. It's that kind of "MG speak" that gets me. Frustrates the hell out of me.

I have to be honest though PP, I generally agree with you...as someone who has left and vocally despises the church, wants my kids OUT and encourage others to get the hell out as well and basically just calls it the way I see (the church is a corrupt corporation at best, a cult at worst) I don't think Bill is the "enemy." I actually see him doing a lot of good to bring down the church by exposing crap to active members who wouldn't listen to you and me. Bill probably doesn't like to hear that, as he often gets accused of being an apostate and wolf in sheep clothing, but when the truth hurts your cause like the truth hurts the Mormon church, honest people who speak the truth and ask tough questions like Bill are by default going to eventually wear that name tag of "apostate."

Two years buddy, two years. Bill, the church cannot survive your kind of honest questions, attitude, perspective and activism. You are too moral and ethical of a guy to NOT get kicked out or just leave. That is just my opinion today.

There is nothing more dangerous to the strict orthodoxy than people like Bill. The church runs a version of the Asch conformity experiment every Sunday in every ward in the world. People who are willing to sit there through all of that boring tedium and express differing reasonable opinions ruin the whole effect, as proven in the variants on that experiment.

While I don't understand the desire to attend church and help them eventually come around (because I personally find the whole environment to be toxic), there is no doubt that the brethren are frightened most of people who stay, who are friendly, and who don't conform. If you reach a critical mass of Bill Reels (people who voice reasonable objections out loud), the church changes. Again, see the Asch conformity experiment and its variants for a practical demonstration.

fetchface wrote:There is nothing more dangerous to the strict orthodoxy than people like Bill. The church runs a version of the Asch conformity experiment every Sunday in every ward in the world. People who are willing to sit there through all of that boring tedium and express differing reasonable opinions ruin the whole effect, as proven in the variants on that experiment.

While I don't understand the desire to attend church and help them eventually come around (because I personally find the whole environment to be toxic), there is no doubt that the brethren are frightened most of people who stay, who are friendly, and who don't conform. If you reach a critical mass of Bill Reels (people who voice reasonable objections out loud), the church changes. Again, see the Asch conformity experiment and its variants for a practical demonstration.

Or they just get rid of them all as they have done in the past... Make them apostates and then you can deride and ridicule them from your great and spacious building...