What Do We Know about the Resurrection of Jesus?

[_Res Ipsa]

As I think I said in another post, I have no decisive proof that God exists. All I'm saying is that if you recognize that your conscientious obligation to future generations of human beings is to try to find out some way to preserve forever some good things, and if that task is too burdensome for you to shoulder all by yourself, then you'd better hope that someone else is able to shoulder it, because it has to be done. On the other hand, if you find that you are able to shoulder it all by yourself, then more power to you, and you have no conscientious need to believe in God at all. Perhaps all you need at that point is to believe in yourself.

Thanks for answering my off-topic questions. Your train of thought was new to me and I wanted to understand it. I guess, to me, a conscientious obligation cannot extend beyond what I am personally capable of. So, I would see the obligation as doing what I can to preserve some good things, and trust to the following generations to do the same. So, I neither require a belief in God nor do I believe I can do it all by myself.

[_I have a question]

As I think I said in another post, I have no decisive proof that God exists. All I'm saying is that if you recognize that your conscientious obligation to future generations of human beings is to try to find out some way to preserve forever some good things, and if that task is too burdensome for you to shoulder all by yourself, then you'd better hope that someone else is able to shoulder it, because it has to be done. On the other hand, if you find that you are able to shoulder it all by yourself, then more power to you, and you have no conscientious need to believe in God at all. Perhaps all you need at that point is to believe in yourself.

Thanks for answering my off-topic questions. Your train of thought was new to me and I wanted to understand it. I guess, to me, a conscientious obligation cannot extend beyond what I am personally capable of. So, I would see the obligation as doing what I can to preserve some good things, and trust to the following generations to do the same. So, I neither require a belief in God nor do I believe I can do it all by myself.

If you want to contribute to preserving some good things forever, bring your kids up right.
Mormonism in totality clearly isn't a universal good thing. Some aspects of it are, but those aren't aspects that are unique to Mormonism. They are general humanity things, like charity, love etc.

Belief in a God, Christ, etc etc aren't necessary to preserving good things forever. People are.

[_Fence Sitter]

Snip

You define God as someone that "preserves good things forever" then admit that not only do you not know what good things are but that they also evolve.

Your entire post illustrate what I am saying, you just are unable to understand why.

So now not only do we not know what good things are, even if we did they are evolving and might be completely different.

You even admit as much here.

It certainly is not clear to me that we're going to spend the rest of eternity with the idea of good being as relative as it now seems to be.

If you yourself cannot recognize those good things god is preserving, how are you going to recognize when He is doing it? For all you know you may be following a being who is preserving evil things forever.

Your definition of God is a meaningless catchphrase that you cannot even explain.

And we still have no idea what "preserve forever" means, especially now that were are defining good as an evolving product.

This is nonsense, even worse nonsense when one tries to fit it into a Mormon milieu, as I tried to illustrate above, which you totally misunderstood.

[_KevinSim]

I'm open to considering the possibility that belief in God may not have improved our world in the past. As I understand it, that's a controversial subject. But pointing to atrocities committed by past religious groups and wondering if that means belief in God might actually not improve our world, is like pointing to atrocities committed by past political systems and wondering if that means government itself might actually not improve our world. Religious mistakes in the past shouldn't be any more reason to take us to John Lennon's world without religion, than political mistakes in the past should be a reason to take us to anarchy.

Some governments do a lot of good, where is the evidence that religion is good for humanity? In fact, the least corrupt governments are mostly secular and non-authoritarian.
See
http://www.transparency.org/news/featur ... index_2016

It may just be a matter of timing. Were there any governments that did a lot of good before the rise of Athenian democracy? Instead of establishing their democracy, should the Greeks have observed how bad the historical record of governments were and chosen anarchy instead?

Thanks for answering my off-topic questions. Your train of thought was new to me and I wanted to understand it. I guess, to me, a conscientious obligation cannot extend beyond what I am personally capable of.

How do you know what you're personally capable of? I think you may be selling yourself short.

So, I would see the obligation as doing what I can to preserve some good things, and trust to the following generations to do the same. So, I neither require a belief in God nor do I believe I can do it all by myself.

What's the difference between those "following generations" and God, as I understand God?

Thanks for answering my off-topic questions. Your train of thought was new to me and I wanted to understand it. I guess, to me, a conscientious obligation cannot extend beyond what I am personally capable of. So, I would see the obligation as doing what I can to preserve some good things, and trust to the following generations to do the same. So, I neither require a belief in God nor do I believe I can do it all by myself.

If you want to contribute to preserving some good things forever, bring your kids up right.
Mormonism in totality clearly isn't a universal good thing. Some aspects of it are, but those aren't aspects that are unique to Mormonism. They are general humanity things, like charity, love etc.

Belief in a God, Christ, etc etc aren't necessary to preserving good things forever. People are.

Well then, IHAQ, be one of the people that are necessary to preserve some good things forever. I don't ask anything more of you than that.

Snip

You define God as someone that "preserves good things forever" then admit that not only do you not know what good things are but that they also evolve.

Your entire post illustrate what I am saying, you just are unable to understand why.

So now not only do we not know what good things are, even if we did they are evolving and might be completely different.

You even admit as much here.

It certainly is not clear to me that we're going to spend the rest of eternity with the idea of good being as relative as it now seems to be.

If you yourself cannot recognize those good things god is preserving, how are you going to recognize when He is doing it? For all you know you may be following a being who is preserving evil things forever.

Your definition of God is a meaningless catchphrase that you cannot even explain.

And we still have no idea what "preserve forever" means, especially now that were are defining good as an evolving product.

This is nonsense, even worse nonsense when one tries to fit it into a Mormon milieu, as I tried to illustrate above, which you totally misunderstood.

You missed my point by claiming that I missed your point.

What people understand about good evolves. If I said good itself evolves I apologize; that may have been misleading. Good itself, I believe, is absolute. When I talked about attitudes evolving, I meant that over time people come to understand good things better. Or do you think that Donald Trump is going to have so much sway over the United States that he moves our understanding of good backwards over the next four years? I don't find that likely.

[_I have a question]

Well then, IHAQ, be one of the people that are necessary to preserve some good things forever. I don't ask anything more of you than that.

You don't get to ask anything of me.
You simply get to choose to debate me. Or not.