Hales latest effort on polygamy

[_grindael]

Smith didn't seem to have a problem impregnating Emma. Rhythm method was 20th century. One of Smith's wives chalked it up to nervousness on the part of the women. We know that it was claimed that Bennett could perform abortions. Smith had a lot of wives and so may not have had sex with the same partners often. And even though he had time to see some, There was a period when Emma was watching him closely and he did not, also, Joseph abandoned his spiritual wives at the end of 1843 and I do not believe he had sex with any of them after that because of Emma's threats to leave him if she caught him at it.

My observations

1836-40 Joseph has affairs with several women (Alger, Morgan-Harris, Heron-Snider, Cleveland).
1840-42 Joseph has sex with other men's wives and "marries" some of them at the end of 1841.
1842-43 Joseph has sex with the single women he "married", after "repenting" of having sex with other men's wives.
1844 Joseph goes into a period of forced celibacy (except for Emma).

[_Fence Sitter]

Perhaps their views changed from Nauvoo, but I doubt it.

You need to look at the changing attitudes and laws.

I think you will find that is exactly what happened.

You might look closely at the term "quickening".

You could start here.

Abortion in America: The Origins and Evolution of National Policy

[_grindael]

I have to shake my head at how Hales presents evidence to support his narrative of "eternity only sealings". Here is a classic example of how he manipulates evidence. This is from his web page on Sarah Kingsley Cleveland:

On May 24, 1839, Joseph wrote a letter to Judge John Cleveland and Sarah whom he had never met. It read: “We have selected a lot [in Nauvoo] for you, just across the street from our own, beside Mr. [George with.] Harris.”1

A letter from John L. Smith, Sarah Kingsley’s son-in-law, to the First Presidency, dated March 8, 1895, states: “In the days of Joseph. Mother [Sarah M. Kingsley (Howe)] Cleveland by advice, was sealed to the prophet in Nauvoo but lived with her [non-LDS] husband John Cleveland.”2
Sarah was also resealed to Joseph Smith vicariously in the Nauvoo Temple in 1846.3

This sealing is consistent with an eternity-only ceremony; however, the dating is unknown....The fact that Sarah was allowed to view Eliza R. Snow’s June 29, 1842, sealing ceremony to Joseph Smith is evidence that she was at that time a polygamy insider. Whether it signifies that she had also been sealed to the Prophet by that time is less clear.

Another question is whether Emma Smith was aware of Sarah’s eternity-only sealing. Emma may have learned of nonsexual eternity-only sealings prior to learning of her husband’s time-and-eternity plural marriages. If so, she may have encouraged some of the eternity-only sealings for women whose husbands were not active Latter-day Saints.

Andrew Jenson recorded that Ruth Vose Sayers was “sealed to the Prophet for eternity . . . in Emma Smith’s presence.”5

Ruth signed an affidavit on May 1, 1869, saying the sealing occurred in “February A. D. 1843” and was performed by Hyrum Smith.6

The timeline is complicated by the fact that Hyrum did not accept plural marriage until several months later on May 26, 1843.7

Regardless, Jenson noted that Emma Smith was present and apparently approved of Ruth’s sealing to Joseph.

Lucy Meserve Smith remembered that at some point in Nauvoo: “Emma had told me . . . they [Joseph’s plural wives] were only sealed for eternity [;] they were not to live with them and have children.”8

Notice the text in blue. To try and support this narrative of an "eternity only sealing", Hales does two things that are very deceptive with the Lucy Meserve Smith quote. First, he says she "remembered that at some point in Nauvoo". Why would he put it that way? Because it makes a difference as to WHEN Lucy heard what Emma said. Hales wants to tie this quote to the Sarah Cleveland marriage which took place (probably) in Feb. 1842 and the Ruth Vose "marriage" which we have no reliable date for and Emma knew nothing about either of them, (Cleveland was one of Emma's Relief Society Councillors). Thing is, we know EXACTLY when Lucy made this comment. Here is the first page of her statement, which covers Emma Smith:

I worked for the Prophet Joseph Smith’s wife Emma Hale Smith Aug. & Sept 1845. She bore testimony to me that Mormonism was true as it came forth from the servant of the Lord Joseph Smith, but said she the Twelve have made Bogus of it. As a matter of course I told George A. what sister Emma had said. He related to me the circumstance of his calling on Joseph late one evening and he was just taking a wash and Joseph told him that one of his wives had just been confined and Emma was the Midwife and he had been assisting her. He told me this to prove to me that the women were married for time, as Emma had told me that Joseph never taught any such thing they were only sealed for eternity they were not to live with them and have children, and now see said she I told her I did not know. You do know said she it’s sticking out to plain I said no more to her but went and told brother George A. Smith how she talked to me. Lucy Meserve Smith, S.L. City, May 18th 1892. MS 8270, CHL.

Emma told Lucy M. Smith these things in Aug & Sept 1845, years after the "marriage" took place. So saying that this took place "sometime in Nauvoo" is disingenuous.

Second... Notice Hales' ellipsis. He leaves out that "Joseph never taught any such thing", (that the women were also "married" to him for "time"). Does this sound like Emma would have encouraged any such sealings, since we know that there was no such thing as a "non-sexual eternity only sealing"? That is simply what Emma wanted them to be, but they were not and we know that she knew this. Emma was "vexed and angry" at Joseph on more than one occasion in 1843 because of his spiritual wives.

Joseph has Sarah Cleveland move right across the street from him, next to Lucinda Morgan Harris. Joseph stayed with Ruth Sayers and her husband in 1842 when he was avoiding the Missourians. He lived with the Harris' family for a time and Emma lived with the Cleveland family when Joseph was locked up in a Missouri Jail.

Yet, a year later, Emma supposedly said this to the sister (Lovina Smith Walker) of Joseph F. Smith:

“I was living with Aunt Emma Smith, in Fulton City Fulton Co. Illinois, in the year 1846. that she told me, that She Emma Smith was present and witnessed the marrying or Sealing of Eliza Partridge, Emily Partridge, Mariah Lawrence, and Sarah Lawrence to her husband, Joseph Smith, and that she gave her concent thereto." (1869 Affidavit)

Hales uses this quote to support Joseph having sex with the Partridges and Lawrence sisters, (TIME & eternity "marriages") but doesn't mention the Lucy M. Smith quote in which Emma, just a year earlier said Joseph never taught any such thing. Notice that Emma's involvement is what they need to make this all work:

Emily Partridge testified that Emma took her hand and placed it in Joseph’s Smith’s hand.2

“Emma had consented to give Joseph two wives if Jo he would let her choose them for him, and as she choose E. [Eliza] and myself the ceremony was done . . . in her pressence, on the 11th of May 1843. . . . She afterwards gave Sarah and Maria Lawrence to him, and they lived in the house as his wifes. I knew this.”3

Since Joseph Smith served as Maria and Sarah’s legal guardian, he has been criticized for being sealed to them. The assumption is that he exercised improper influence to coerce them into their plural marriages. Arguing against this assumption is the fact Emma Smith facilitated those marriages even if she afterwards regretted it. (Hales, Maria Lawrence page)

Was Emma simply a schizophrenic who just changed her mind at the drop of a hat and accepted everything then didn't, then admitted things and then didn't? What is wrong with this picture? Someone is lying that's what. When Emma was presented with Joseph's spiritual wife "revelation" she said in 1843 that she didn't believe a word of it. So how is she giving her permission and participating in these "marriages"?

[_Philo Sofee]

EXCELLENT analysis Grindael! It is yet again, more evidence of why I have truly ceased believing anything I read from LDS scholarship unless it has been thoroughly checked. They cheat with sources just exactly like they accuse their own enemies of doing. I am really seeing religion as just being a huge cheat sheet from all sides, with no real interest in reality. And the foundation is the scriptures themselves which were created as cheat sheets.

[_grindael]

Yeah, this has been a focus of my research for the last five years. I will be presenting on this (Emma & The 1869 Utah Affidavits) at the John Whitmer Conference in the fall at Nauvoo.

[_Philo Sofee]

Yeah, this has been a focus of my research for the last five years. I will be presenting on this (Emma & The 1869 Utah Affidavits) at the John Whitmer Conference in the fall at Nauvoo.

Where and when is that meeting occurring? I would LOVE to be there......

[_Maksutov]

Yeah, this has been a focus of my research for the last five years. I will be presenting on this (Emma & The 1869 Utah Affidavits) at the John Whitmer Conference in the fall at Nauvoo.

Excellent!

[_grindael]

Yeah, this has been a focus of my research for the last five years. I will be presenting on this (Emma & The 1869 Utah Affidavits) at the John Whitmer Conference in the fall at Nauvoo.

Where and when is that meeting occurring? I would LOVE to be there......

Nauvoo, 23rd of September, 2017. 8 AM. Don't know the exact location in Nauvoo yet. I'd love to see some of the rabble from this board there. It would really make my day.

[_aussieguy55]

Isn't Hales involved with that group also?

[_grindael]

Isn't Hales involved with that group also?

He is a member of the association and was a past president of the association.