Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

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_Shulem
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Shulem »

For the record kiddies

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Parley P. Pratt (1842) wrote:When we read the Book of Abraham with the reflection that its light has burst upon the world after a silence of three or four thousand years, during which it has slumbered in the bosom of the dead, and been sealed up in the sacred archives of Egypt’s mouldering ruins


The Golden Plates were buried and sealed up at the hand of Moroni some 1400 years before Joseph Smith uncovered them to the light of day.

thus the plates are dated

SO ALSO:

The Papyrus of the Book of Abraham written by his own hand had been "sealed up in the sacred archives of Egypt’s mouldering ruins" for thousands of years.

thus the papyrus is dated
_Amore
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Amore »

Shulem wrote:
Amore wrote: The placebo effect is another way of saying “As a man thinketh in his heart, so is he” and “faith is evidence of things not seen.”


BOOK OF ABRAHAM FACSIMILES FEATURED IN PAINTING.

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Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints think and feel through their faith that the Book of Abraham is true scripture and that Joseph Smith was inspired in producing it. In this very point, both the critic and believer are in total agreement. Note that for the believer the buck stops with faith but for the critic the buck stops with science. Who has the stronger argument in proving their case? The critics do, hands down, it's a cinch or in other words: A slam dunk.

:wink:

I agree - as far as historical truth, critics win by a landslide. Actually, the entire Bible is questionable. There are beautiful, and inspiringly truthful parts, but there are also immoral evil in it, and so with Joseph Smith’s works. And another little fact many conveniently ignore, is that the Old Testament was written by people who hate and want to harm or kill “goyem” (everyone besides their relatively small group). How the hell did this book become so blindly accepted?

The books in the Bible were collected and twisted by the “universal church” who tortured or killed those who didn’t believe. And Mormonism is largely based on this deceptive evil. I believe they twisted Christ’s words. Almost quoting Buddha Christ warned against looking externally for the kingdom of God to come because it’s within each of us. Yet, the Catholic church insisted people look to them and they imagined up human sacrifice scapegoating nonsense that is so obviously not of God.

It seems that in the Freemason/Anti-Christ/lds temple ritual, “Satan” was the appropriate one to say, “Oh, you want someone to preach to you. You want religion, do you? I will have preachers here presently.”
_Philo Sofee
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Philo Sofee »

Amore
The books in the Bible were collected and twisted by the “universal church” who tortured or killed those who didn’t believe. And Mormonism is largely based on this deceptive evil. I believe they twisted Christ’s words. Almost quoting Buddha Christ warned against looking externally for the kingdom of God to come because it’s within each of us. Yet, the Catholic church insisted people look to them and they imagined up human sacrifice scapegoating nonsense that is so obviously not of God.

It seems that in the Freemason/Anti-Christ/LDS temple ritual, “Satan” was the appropriate one to say, “Oh, you want someone to preach to you. You want religion, do you? I will have preachers here presently.”


That's actually an outstanding point Amore, especially about Satan giving us preachers who in turn fog our mind about who we really are and what we really and truly do actually possess! Tomorrow I am going to be giving a speech/sermon at the Unitarian Universalist church and what I am using of Alan Watts really perfectly dove tails with this.

This from his beautiful and inspiring book Become What You Are, Shambala, 2018, (pp. 85-91)and part of my speech, if you will allow me to share a little bit of it. I promise it will inspire!

What then, is a truly deep feeling of salvation? Insofar as this question can be answered at all, perhaps it is best to consider one of the greatest doctrines in all religion in terms of a state of mind.

For this purpose the best choice is probably the Hindu or Vedanta conception of Brahman, because this is at once the simplest and the most subtle of doctrines – subtle just because it is so simple. The same doctrine is found in other systems, but Vedanta gives it the best philosophical expression.

It is that all possible things, events, thoughts and qualities are aspects of a single reality, which is sometimes called the Self of the Universe. In themselves these many aspects have no reality; they are real only in that each one of them is a manifestation of Brahman or the Self.

To put it another way, the true self of any given thing is Brahman and not something that belongs exclusively to the thing in question. Each individual is therefore an aspect of Brahman, and no two aspects are the same.

But man’s self is much more than what he considers to be his ego or his personality called John Smith or William Jones or Sally Denton. The ego is a device or trick (maya) employed so that Brahman may manifest itself, and man’s innermost self is therefore identical with the Self of all things. Thus if anyone wants to know what Brahman is he has just to look around, to think, to act, to be aware, to live, for all that is known by the sense, thought in the mind, or felt in the heart is Brahman.

In other systems of thought Brahman has many other names – Tao in Chinese, and mystics the world over find similar meaning in the words God, Allah, Infinite, Life, Elan Vital, the Absolute, or whatever other term may be used.

In fact, the intuition of the One Reality is the essence of all mystical religion, but few people understand clearly what it is to feel this intuition in oneself. We are, perhaps, more apt to think of this idea as just a metaphysical speculation, a more or les reasonable theory about the fundamental structure of life. Someday, we think, it might be possible for us to delve down into the deepest recesses of our souls, lay our fingers on this mysterious universal essence and avail ourselves of its tremendous powers. This, however, does not seem quite right. For one thing, it is not to be found only in the deepest recesses of our souls, and for another thing, the word essence makes it sound as if it were highly refined, somewhat gaseous or electric and wholly formless potency that somehow dwells inside of things. But in relation to Brahman there is neither inside nor outside; sometimes it is called the principle of nonduality because nothing else exists beside it and nothing is excluded from it.

It is to be found on the surface as much as in the depths and in the finite as much as in the infinite, for it has wisely been said that “there is nothing infinite apart from finite things.”

Thus it can be neither lost not found and you cannot avail yourself of its powers any more than you can dispense with them, for all these conceptions of having and not having, of gain and loss, finite and infinite, belong to the principle of duality. Every dualism is exclusive; it is this and not that, that and not this. But Brahman as the One Reality is all-inclusive, for the Upanishads say:

It is made of consciousness and mind: It is made of life and vision. It is made of the earth and of the waters; it is made of air and space; It is made of light and darkness; It is made of desire and peace. It is made of anger and love; it is made of virtue and vice; It is made of all that is near; It is made of all that is afar; It is made of all.

What, then, is nonduality in terms of a state of mind? How does the mystic who has realized his identity with the One Reality think and feel? Does his consciousness expand from out of his body and enter into all other things, so that he sees with others eyes and thinks with others brains? Only figuratively, for the Self which is in him and in all others does not necessarily communicate to the physical brain of John Smith, mystic, what is seen by the eyes of Pei-Wang, construction worker, on the other side of the earth. I do not believe that spiritual illumination is to be understood in quite this sensational way.

We shall answer the question sufficiently if we can discover what is a nondualistic state of mind. Does it mean a mind in so intense a state of concentration that it contains only one thought? Strictly speaking, the mind never contains more than one thought at a time; such is the nature of thinking.

But if spirituality means thinking only and always of one particular thing, then other things are excluded and this is still duality. Does it mean, then, a mind which is thinking of everything at once? Even if this were possible, it would exclude the convenient faculty of thinking of one thing at a time and would still be dualistic. Clearly these two interpretations are absurd, but there is another way of approach.

Spiritual illumination is often described as absolute freedom of the soul, and we have seen that the One Reality is all-inclusive. Is the mind of the mystic singularly free and all inclusive? If so, it would seem that his spirituality does not depend on thinking any kind of special thoughts, on having a particular feeling ever in the background of his soul. He is free to think of anything and nothing, to love and to fear, to be joyful or sad, to set his mind on philosophy or on the trivial concerns of the world; he is free to be both a sage and a fool, to feel both compassion and anger, to experience both bliss and agony.

And in all this he never breaks his identity with the One Reality – God, Whose service is perfect freedom. For he knows that in whatever direction he goes and in whichever of these many opposites he is engaged, he is still in perfect harmony with the One that includes all directions and all opposites. In this sense, serving God is just living; it is not a question of the way in which you live, because all ways are included in God. To understand this is to wake up to your freedom to be alive.

But is that ALL? Is it possible that spirituality can be anything so absurdly simple? It seems to mean that to attain spirituality you have to just go on living as you have always lived; all life being God, and kind of life is spiritual. You say that if the idea were not so ludicrous it would be exceedingly dangerous. First we might remind ourselves of a saying of the Chinese sage Lau Tzu:

When the wise man hears of the Tao, he puts it into practice… When the fool hears of it, he laughs at it. Indeed it would not be worthy to be called the Tao if he did not laugh at it.

The idea that any kind of life is spiritual is a terrible blow to man’s pride; from the spiritual point of view it puts us on the same level as stones, vegetables, worms, and beetles; it makes the righteous man no nearer to salvation than the criminal and the sage no nearer than the lunatic. Thus if all else about the idea is folly, it is at least a powerful antidote to spiritual pride and self-reward for being a good boy. Indeed, it is not something which you can GET at all, however fierce your efforts, however great your learning and however tireless your virtue is. In the spiritual world there is no top and bottom of the class. Here all men and women are equal and whatever they do can go neither up nor down. The only difference between sage or mystic and ordinary, unenlightened man is that the one realizes his identity with God or Brahman, whereas the other does not. But the lack or realization does not alter the fact.

How, then, does one attain this realization? Is it just a matter of going on living as one has lived before, knowing that one is free to do just exactly as one likes? Beware of the false freedom of doing as you like; to be really free you must also be free to do as you don’t like, for if you are only free to do as you like you are still tied up in dualism, being bound by your own whims.

A better way of attaining realization is to let yourself be free to be ignorant, for fools are also one with God. If you strive to attain realization and try to make yourself God, you simply become an intense egotist. But if you allow yourself freedom to be yourself, you will discover that God is not what you have to BECOME, but what you ARE – in spite of yourself. For have we not heard it said a thousand times that God is always found in humble places?

The Tao, said Lao Tzu, is like water; it seeks the lowly level which men abhor. And while we are busy trying to add cubits to our stature so that we may reach up to heaven, we forget that we are getting no nearer to it and no further away. For the Kingdom of heaven is within you.
Dr CamNC4Me
"Dr. Peterson and his Callithumpian cabal of BYU idiots have been marginalized by their own inevitable irrelevancy defending a fraud."
_Shulem
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Shulem »

Future Edition of
THE BOOK OF ABRAHAM wrote:

THE BOOK OF ABRAHAM

TRANSLATED [1] REVEALED FROM THE PAPYRUS, BY JOSEPH SMITH

A Translation [2] Revelation of some ancient Records that have fallen into our hands from the catacombs of Egypt. The writings of Abraham while he was [3] in Egypt, called the Book of Abraham, written by his own hand, [4] a copy upon papyrus.




NOTES

1. The message of the papyrus was understood by the Spirit of revelation and was translated in a spiritual sense to restore the story.

2. Translation signifies the ability of a prophet, seer, and revelator to reveal messages from one language to another in a variety of ways through the Spirit.

3. The papyrus in possession of the church represented the original papyrus had by Abraham who went to Egypt.

4. We understand that the original record of Abraham was preserved and copied by the Egyptians and hid up until the last days.
_Philo Sofee
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Philo Sofee »

By the way, my speech/sermon the other day at the UU went really well! I put over half the audience to sleep! That's gotta be a record... :lol:
Dr CamNC4Me
"Dr. Peterson and his Callithumpian cabal of BYU idiots have been marginalized by their own inevitable irrelevancy defending a fraud."
_Shulem
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Shulem »

Jeffrey Holland, an ignorant Mormon apostle, ADMITS that he doesn't know jack about Egyptology or how Joseph Smith translated:

---BBC Book Of Abraham 38 second video---

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It certainly is evident that Holland has a problem and is in no position to explain the false translations of Facsimile No. 3. None of the apostles can explain it. Not even the prophet. They are a bunch of dumb asses, liars for the Lord.

The apostles of Mormonism stand rebuked! You're rebuked! All of you.

Shulem rebukes you!

:twisted:
_Amore
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Amore »

Philo Sofee wrote:By the way, my speech/sermon the other day at the UU went really well! I put over half the audience to sleep! That's gotta be a record... :lol:

Excellent! I’m so excited to discuss this with you. I’ll begin another thread. by the way, was it at the UU in SLC?
_Philo Sofee
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Philo Sofee »

Amore wrote:
Philo Sofee wrote:By the way, my speech/sermon the other day at the UU went really well! I put over half the audience to sleep! That's gotta be a record... :lol:

Excellent! I’m so excited to discuss this with you. I’ll begin another thread. by the way, was it at the UU in Salt Lake City?

No, the one in Idaho Falls. I would like to see the one in Salt Lake, I hear it is very lovely!
Dr CamNC4Me
"Dr. Peterson and his Callithumpian cabal of BYU idiots have been marginalized by their own inevitable irrelevancy defending a fraud."
_Amore
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Amore »

Philo Sofee wrote:No, the one in Idaho Falls. I would like to see the one in Salt Lake, I hear it is very lovely!

I went only briefly because I don’t live in Slc either, but it did seem nice - very organized (asked if I wanted to sign up for a pot luck).
_Philo Sofee
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Re: Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph

Post by _Philo Sofee »

Bump for Muhlestein and Givens if they decide to come over here and defend themselves in their new You Tube video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJtkwzW ... e=youtu.be

I asked them in the comments to come over here and lets have an open and realistic discussion instead of all this talking past each other. They make many foolish and incorrect claims in the video. This has to stop.
Dr CamNC4Me
"Dr. Peterson and his Callithumpian cabal of BYU idiots have been marginalized by their own inevitable irrelevancy defending a fraud."
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