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Wade England returns!
Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:28 pm
by _RockSlider
After a six year absence, Wade is drawn back to MDDB over Book of Abraham with a new user, 25 posts!
http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/716 ... 1209894471
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:45 pm
by _Fence Sitter
He is in for a rude awakening over there.
All his old buddies are gone and the new crowd is a lot more open to the Book of Abraham being just an inspired text, not a direct translation. Only Bob Smith is still pushing Joseph Smith ability to produce an accurate translation from the papyri, though Bob makes it almost impossible to pin him down on what he think Joseph Smith actually did. On the one had he claims Joseph Smith could not translate Egyptian but on the other Bob claims:
Joseph's interpretations of the illustrations are so often correct that one can only conclude, based on Egyptological scholarship, that Joseph's translation of the Book of Abraham text is also correct, as I point out using standard Egyptology in my “Brief Assessment of the LDS Book of Abraham,” version 10 online Mar 21, 2019, online at
https://www.scribd.com/document/1188107 ... of-Abraham .
Of course this is nonsense.
Now Wade is engaging Ed Gobel. That is really going to be a hoot to watch.
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:53 pm
by _Shulem
Oh my.
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:19 pm
by _RockSlider
The narrator/bob have an extended exchange here as well, good stuff. I did not realize that the Book of Abraham apologetics have moved to a pseudepigraphic 1st century author whom Joseph Smith was being a pseudepigraphic author of.
Book of Abraham apologetics just continues to get more and more bizarre.
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 3:01 am
by _cwald
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:20 am
by _moksha
RockSlider wrote:Book of Abraham apologetics just continues to get more and more bizarre.
Wait for the end stage, when the apologetic position is that there never was a Book of Abraham and that its existence is a false claim made by anti-Mormons based on their desire to sin.
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:27 am
by _Gadianton
It looks like he's going to get his first hundred posts in thoroughly hedging his bet so he can't possibly lose. He's lecturing Clark, of all people, on the importance of spiritual confirmation, and all the scholarly fuss a barely interesting aside if that. Then, he's making sure anything that could put it in the 19th century is exactly as he'd expect God to operate -- he spoke in their language and wouldn't want to confuse anybody by revealing something verifiable as ancient. (have to wonder if God speaking in our language is so important why it can't be a modern text as Narrator says). Finally, he's making sure Clark is aware -- as he might not know -- that God can't make it too obvious, otherwise there would be no room for faith. So he's getting a nice first-rate hole dug in the sand right off the bat, ready for his head in case at any point as he moves forward he can instantly protect himself so that he doesn't experience even the slightest pain.
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 3:21 pm
by _Shulem
Gadianton wrote:It looks like he's going to get his first hundred posts in thoroughly hedging his bet so he can't possibly lose. He's lecturing Clark, of all people, on the importance of spiritual confirmation, and all the scholarly fuss a barely interesting aside if that. Then, he's making sure anything that could put it in the 19th century is exactly as he'd expect God to operate -- he spoke in their language and wouldn't want to confuse anybody by revealing something verifiable as ancient. (have to wonder if God speaking in our language is so important why it can't be a modern text as Narrator says). Finally, he's making sure Clark is aware -- as he might not know -- that God can't make it too obvious, otherwise there would be no room for faith. So he's getting a nice first-rate hole dug in the sand right off the bat, ready for his head in case at any point as he moves forward he can instantly protect himself so that he doesn't experience even the slightest pain.
I refuse to engage them on the current apologetic of trying to justify the Book of Abraham with the nonsense Clark and others are spouting. It's all a red herring and has no bearing whatsoever on what Joseph Smith and his companions claimed. Today's apologetics is DOA. Don't even bother addressing it. Just quote Joseph Smith. Quote Oliver Cowdery. Quote those who were involved with the production of the Book of Abraham. Quote Joseph Smith's crazy mother too. Quote all those nuts!
Today's apologists are simply lying to themselves and anyone else who will listen to them. They are without honor. That includes Ed. Sorry to say. He's lost in the fray of defending the indefensible. The Book of Abraham cannot be defended from Joseph Smith's point of view and it's Joseph Smith's point of view that counts!
Re: Wade England returns!
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:09 pm
by _reflexzero
moksha wrote:RockSlider wrote:Book of Abraham apologetics just continues to get more and more bizarre.
Wait for the end stage, when the apologetic position is that there never was a Book of Abraham and that its existence is a false claim made by anti-Mormons based on their desire to sin.
