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Lemmie wrote:I don’t get the tithing comment either. According to the article mg linked to earlier in this thread:

"Doctrine is what the current prophets, seers, and revelators are teaching. They include eternal, essential truths necessary for our salvation..."

Tithing is a law with an underlying doctrine of sacrifice unto the Lord. Abraham offered up a sacrifice. Jesus offered Himself a sacrifice for sin. Tithing is another manifestation of our willingness to sacrifice unto God that which is His. But tithing itself, albeit a requirement for attending the temple, is a law unto the church. All of the Q15 are on board with the doctrine of sacrifice. They are also all on board with the law of tithing.

Lemmie wrote:So marriage sealing is “essential to exaltation.”

Yes.

Lemmie wrote:...it’s pretty clear that lgbtq policies are not ‘just policies’.

They are policies. They support and maintain the doctrine of sealing ordinances between a man and a woman being necessary for exaltation. Take that policy away and let LGBTQ folks participate in sealing ordinances would corrupt/contaminate a pure doctrine.

Doctrines remain the same. Practice and policy CAN change. I don't see LGBTQ policies changing, however, because that would entail a corruption/contamination of the pure doctrine of the church and commandments of God.

Regards,
MG

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:...responsible adults are constantly having to pick up after [MG]...

Define "responsible adults".

I am seeing a bit of arrogance creeping through again with your comments.

Regards,
MG

Lemmie wrote:So marriage sealing is “essential to exaltation.”

From Doctrine 8:

Marriage between a man and a woman is ordained of God....

The earth was created and the gospel was revealed so that families could be formed, sealed, and exalted eternally...

So if we can take this LDS.org Doctrine page seriously, it’s pretty clear that lgbtq policies are not ‘just policies’.

Link to the LDS.org Doctrines page:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/bc/ ... f?lang=eng

Mr Oaks stated doctrine is something that hasn't changed. We know the Mormon version of marriage has changed. Therefore #8 on the list of basic doctrine isn’t valid. The same thing applies to Ordinances & Covenants, that have changed. so #7 isn’t valid.

I have a question wrote:Mr Oaks stated doctrine is something that hasn't changed. We know the Mormon version of marriage has changed. Therefore #8 on the list of basic doctrine isn’t valid. The same thing applies to Ordinances & Covenants, that have changed. so #7 isn’t valid.

Agreed, none of this is valid. I was just pointing out the inconsistencies within the internal document.

But it takes quite a bit of hubris to try to calm people by saying the lds church’s positions re: how lgbtq are treated are “just policy, “ if, as mg puts it, changing that policy to accept lgbtq marriages would “corrupt [and] contaminate” their “pure doctrine.”

Add that to your point about how doctrine has changed many times already, and it just collapses to discrimination.

Lemmie wrote:

I have a question wrote:Mr Oaks stated doctrine is something that hasn't changed. We know the Mormon version of marriage has changed. Therefore #8 on the list of basic doctrine isn’t valid. The same thing applies to Ordinances & Covenants, that have changed. so #7 isn’t valid.

Agreed, none of this is valid. I was just pointing out the inconsistencies within the internal document.

But it takes quite a bit of hubris to try to calm people by saying the LDS church’s positions re: how lgbtq are treated are “just policy, “ if, as mg puts it, changing that policy to accept lgbtq marriages would “corrupt [and] contaminate” their “pure doctrine.”

Add that to your point about how doctrine has changed many times already, and it just collapses to discrimination.

Spot on.

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:I’ll tell you what the only consistent doctrines that have been in place since its inception are:

Pay
Pray
Obey

I was contemplating a few consistent doctrines that might potentially spoil your wonderful alliteration. Alas, each fits neatly into the framework. Well done.

Would love somebody to post those nine basic doctrines of the Church that haven’t changed since the Restoration...EASY

1. Horny Holy Joe is the Man, buds with Mormon man god and Pal of Mormon Bastard jebus
2. Do as we do, unless it's something we want to do, but don't want you to do, then do as you are told
3. Continuing revelation means we can change anything we want to at any time and you can't question it, so shut-up, pay, pray and obey.
4. Women are commodities unless they bitch about it, then they aren't commodities but in Mormon heaven they will always be commodities.
5. Temples are necessary because it is the way we control you rubes. Temple worthy means temple blessed - money poor.
6. GOD DAMMIT Tithing is GROSS NOT NET. Stupid damned Huntsman Sr. (https://www.forbes.com/sites/andrewcave ... 58f0773e11)
7. We eat, party, live and travel like the Pharisees and Sadducee but are humble (NOT!) like Biblical jesus in our minds so stop asking how the Money is spent
8. Study and Ponderize but don't study to hard or ponderize too much, because Intelligence in NOT the Glory of god, obedience is.
9. And last of all Screw you All and “F” the Horse you rode in on if you dare doubt our Greatness and Glory.

STUPID damned Mormons

All Hail Google GOD and her son eBay and the holy toaster youtube

mentalgymnast wrote:

DoubtingThomas wrote:...our beloved apostle Dallin H. Oaks...

You don't really believe/think that, do you? Those that do love him wouldn't be dissing him.

Regards,
MG

What I believe doesn't matter, you need to listen to the apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ.

mentalgymnast wrote:If you had actually listened to this podcast you wouldn't have said this.

Regards,
MG

Nope! You have to stop listening to podcasts that are not approved by the church. You are falling into apostasy. Remember what the apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ said, "Excessive reliance on personal teachings or speculations may even draw us aside from concentrating on learning and efforts that will further our understanding and help us go forward on the covenant path."

Philo Sofee wrote:That literally eliminates the entire New Testament. Way to go Oaks..... what a dork.

Amen, Philo.

As a missionary, we were instructed to teach that one of the greatest blessings of the restored church is a prophet to teach pure doctrine revealed by God. No voting bodies or debates, no room for opinions of men to muddy the water. Just clear unadulterated revelation through the prophet. I opened my old missionary journals today and found notes from one particular training meeting with a since deceased GA, which included a side by side comparison of the false philosophies of men, mingled with scripture, born out of the Council of Nicea. Next to, of course, the eternal truths of the restoration.

This left an impression and I taught the third discussion by using the example throughout my mission.

Obviously this 15 member voting requirement appears highly convenient as a fresh mechanism to wipe away undesirable past (and present?) teachings, but the downside is a decidedly less miraculous system. As the idea sinks in, I am more and more shocked that this additional process, in essence a dirtying filter, is being pushed on the membership as defining the gate for church wide doctrinal revelation.