RFM Vs. Midnight Mormons: My Video on the Epic Debate

[Kishkumen]

I left in the part where your phone call interrupted me too Kish! Yer famous now!

I watched and I was absolutely astounded to see you pick up my call, refer to me, and then come back to call me "friends in high places." It was really quite touching, and I love the fact that only a very few people will have any idea to whom you were referring!

[Philo Sofee]

I left in the part where your phone call interrupted me too Kish! Yer famous now!

I watched and I was absolutely astounded to see you pick up my call, refer to me, and then come back to call me "friends in high places." It was really quite touching, and I love the fact that only a very few people will have any idea to whom you were referring!

Well... I mean... I can't let an insignificant thing like a video recording production get in the way of talking to a great friend and scholar....

[Kishkumen]

Well... I mean... I can't let an insignificant thing like a video recording production get in the way of talking to a great friend and scholar....

Why thank you, friend! I am honored!

[Moksha]

Kerry, if you are serious about doing your own interviews why not start with Kishkumen? Other sure-fire interviews would be Hagoth from the NOM forum and Shulem safely ensconced in an Anubis mask.

[Philo Sofee]

Kerry, if you are serious about doing your own interviews why not start with Kishkumen? Other sure-fire interviews would be Hagoth from the NOM forum and Shulem safely ensconced in an Anubis mask.

Oh man, and yourself too! I have to get back over to NOM! Yes, this is a stellar suggestion...

[Bought Yahoo]

Start with me. I'll debate you. You can pick the questions. Just don't make it about me which I know you won't.

[Morley]

Start with me. I'll debate you. You can pick the questions. Just don't make it about me which I know you won't.

I'd love to watch this.

[Moksha]

Start with me. I'll debate you. You can pick the questions. Just don't make it about me which I know you won't.

I can see Kerry wanting to discuss ideas and issues rather than debating. Are you good to go on a number of issues?

[Kishkumen]

Yeah, I’m not sure I want to see you guys debate. I’d rather see a less adversarial discussion. Debates suck.

[Gabriel]

Very good recap, Philo!

One of the more amusing clips that you showed was when Kwaku was explaining the noble history of glass-looking from John Dee to Joseph Smith. He said so much in 30 seconds that I can only remember the part about Solomon's temple and the Jupiter Talisman before Kwaku decided to hold up his magic ring for all the audience to see. I doubt that even FAIR would post the manifest drivel that he was sputtering.

John Dee was intelligent but gullible. Not having any abilities in the glass-looking department, he searched around until he became impressed with an opportunistic, convicted forger who said that he could communicate with angels.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dee

Dee's first attempts with several scryers were unsatisfactory, but in 1582 he met Edward Kelley (then calling himself Edward Talbot to disguise his conviction for "coining" or forgery), who impressed him greatly with his abilities. Dee took Kelley into his service and began to devote all his energies to his supernatural pursuits.

John Dee was on the cusp of falling out of court when he was persuaded by Kelley's "angels" to search for greener pastures on the continent.

In 1583, Dee met the impoverished yet popular Polish nobleman Albert Łaski, who, after overstaying his welcome at court, invited Dee to accompany him back to Poland. With some prompting by the "angels" (again through Kelley) and by dint of his worsening status at court, Dee decided to do so. He, Kelley, and their families left in September 1583, but Łaski proved to be bankrupt and out of favour in his own country. Dee and Kelley began a nomadic life in Central Europe, meanwhile continuing their spiritual conferences, which Dee detailed in his diaries and almanacs.

I don't know if the Angel Uriel threatened him with a drawn sword, but Kelley told Dee that the time had come to start "swinging".

In 1587, at a spiritual conference in Bohemia, Kelley told Dee that the angel Uriel had ordered the men to share all their possessions, including their wives. By this time, Kelley had gained some renown as an alchemist and was more sought-after than Dee in this regard: it was a line of work that had prospects for serious and long-term financial gain, especially among the royal families of central Europe. Dee, however, was more interested in communicating with angels, who he believed would help him solve the mysteries of the heavens through mathematics, optics, astrology, science and navigation. Perhaps Kelley in fact wished to end Dee's dependence on him as a diviner at their increasingly lengthy, frequent spiritual conferences. The order for wife-sharing caused Dee anguish, but he apparently did not doubt it was genuine and they apparently shared wives.