Internet Mormons, Chapel Mormons, Critics, Apologists, and Never-Mo's all welcome!
https://discussmormonism.com/
You mean like true Scotsmen?LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Apr 07, 2022 2:01 pmYou see, real Christians do not specifically equate belonging to a denomination with their own salvation. They will see their salvation as a relationship with GOD the FATHER through GOD the SON and being baptized through the spiritual indwelling of GOD the SPIRIT.
Nothing wrong with a good Presbyterian, except they allow baby christenings. I see nothing wrong with baby dedication, but the child should not be "baptized" until he/she has made a profession of faith (an outward sign of an inward change) testimonial. And this is yet another reason I do not approve of Mormonism. They actually believe the water immersion is necessary for salvation. I do not. It is an illustration that a believer can participate in, and helps to make one willing to be flexible to GOD wishes.Kishkumen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 07, 2022 8:28 pmYou mean like true Scotsmen?LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Apr 07, 2022 2:01 pmYou see, real Christians do not specifically equate belonging to a denomination with their own salvation. They will see their salvation as a relationship with GOD the FATHER through GOD the SON and being baptized through the spiritual indwelling of GOD the SPIRIT.
In the PCA church it is more of a dedication that the parents and church vow to help nurture and lead the child to Christ. There is nothing salvific about the sprinkling of babies in the PCA church. This is the same way I understood it when I was raised in the United Methodist Church.LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Apr 07, 2022 9:10 pmNothing wrong with a good Presbyterian, except they allow baby christenings. I see nothing wrong with baby dedication, but the child should not be "baptized" until he/she has made a profession of faith (an outward sign of an inward change) testimonial. And this is yet another reason I do not approve of Mormonism. They actually believe the water immersion is necessary for salvation. I do not. It is an illustration that a believer can participate in, and helps to make one willing to be flexible to GOD wishes.
You don't really need to capitalize words to add emphasis.LittleNipper wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 2:02 pmThanks for the clarification. I know that CHRISTIANS sometime struggle with semantics and pre, mid, and post Tribulation. But we ALL hold to the TRINITY (meaning Jesus may have emptied HIMSELF while living on this earth but being GOD's SON meant HE was indeed GOD). We ALL hold to the VIRGIN BIRTH. We ALL hold to the sanctity of the Holy Scriptures. We ALL hold to the necessity of the DEATH, BURIAL. and RESURRESTION of JESUS CHRIST. We ALL believe Jesus is the heir to the throne of David and will return to reign for 1000 years. We ALL hold to repentance and faith in OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST as the ONLY means of Salvation.
For Presbyterians, baptizing a child is for the purposes of bringing that child into the covenant the parents have with God. Since Presbyterians traditionally hold to a Calvinistic soteriology, the baptism doesn't confer any grace that wasn't already there. By contrast, Lutherans also baptize children, because they believe in baptismal regeneration, which just means that the act of baptism enables salvation (but doesn't guarantee it).msnobody wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 1:26 amIn the PCA church it is more of a dedication that the parents and church vow to help nurture and lead the child to Christ. There is nothing salvific about the sprinkling of babies in the PCA church. This is the same way I understood it when I was raised in the United Methodist Church.
The thing I struggled with when we joined the PCA church was the Lord’s supper and baptism as sacraments versus ordinances. Once I understood it better, I found that it being considered a sacrament brought much deeper meaning.
GOD gives one the faith. Water is just water. 1 Timothy 1:4Physics Guy wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 4:49 pmInfant versus believer baptism is a tricky question. Apart from whether or not the magic water—or the the magic profession of faith—will save your soul, the two kinds of ritual offer different advantages. Getting immersed in cold water as a teenager or adult, in front of a lot of people who know you, after or before making some kind of public and personal statement to all of them, is one of those once-in-a-lifetime experiences that is bound to mean something. Confirmation isn't nearly as cool. On the other hand it means something to a community if it declares that even infants are in an important sense full members.
You gain something and lose something significant whichever way you decide. I'm for infant baptism because I feel that no matter how meaningful baptism may feel when you're old enough to experience it, those kinds of subjective feelings aren't ultimately all that important. I think the recognition that before God we are all basically infants is more important.
But I can see a good case for the other viewpoint as well. Precisely because we are really all more childlike, even animal-like, than we may like to think, perhaps we should accept that we need to mark important changes in life with emotional experiences like public speaking and immersion in water.
LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Apr 07, 2022 2:01 pmYou see, real Christians do not specifically equate...
classic
PCA Church Book of OrderFor Presbyterians, baptizing a child is for the purposes of bringing that child into the covenant the parents have with God. Since Presbyterians traditionally hold to a Calvinistic soteriology, the baptism doesn't confer any grace that wasn't already there. By contrast, Lutherans also baptize children, because they believe in baptismal regeneration, which just means that the act of baptism enables salvation (but doesn't guarantee it).
Come let us reason together.I'm fascinated by the debates between Credo and Paedo baptism within Christianity.
