Homosexual Tension is Featured as the First "Undaunted" Episode Debuts

[Kishkumen]

Thanks to our own Dr. Stak for his penetrating insights into the symbolic sexual demimonde percolating and popping out from the surface of this film! I for one am happy that D. Michael Quinn’s exploration of homosociality among the saints is finding cinematic expression in these films from the aptly named Interpreter Foundation.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

[good] friends indeed should lie down upon the same bed at night locked in each other['s] embrace talking of their love & should awake in the morning together. They could immediately renew their conversation of love even while rising from their bed.

I suppose the terms used to describe early Mormonism - homoaffectionalism, homocultural, homoemotional, homoenvironmental, homoerotic, homomarital, homopastoral, homophobia, homoromantic, homosocial, and homotactile aren’t actually hyperbole after all! Sharp eyes, Dr. Scratch.

- Doc

[Shulem]

I hate to burst everyone's bubble but after reviewing the video clip several times with my young husband who is 25 years younger than me (I'm a dirty old man), we have determined this was not sexual innuendo of gay nature. Smith hugs little brother and notices right away that he stinks like he's "been on the road for a week." Then he is introduced to Cowdery and more or less acknowledges the script and concludes that Cowdery must also stink and is in need of a bath. Smith was just looking him up and down like, "okay, time to hit the shower you smelly guy, you."

This is not gay innuendo. Doctor Scratch, you blew this one. Sorry, I wish I could say otherwise but that's the opinion of two gay guys who have been around the block a time or two or, several times.

[dastardly stem]

That was an enjoyable episode. I'll look forward to more. I do enjoy how it's portrayed by the good professor and likely the film that Oliver just couldn't get over his jealously the moment Sydney found priority in Joseph's heart.

In truth Joseph plain used people at every opportunity. That'd be the MO of a religious opportunist. They often appear wonderful and kind until all the praising "yes's" become questions and no's. Joseph's use of excommunication on Oliver is akin to a teenager attempting to embarrass and humiliate an ex to gratify pride, one's vain ambition, or to exercise control or dominion or compulsion over the souls of the children of men....

see I'm still Mormon.

[Physics Guy]

Having looked at the clip, I'm grateful for Shulem's post, because I would have felt naïve about not seeing all the homosexual tension. The thing with a shovel is what you do to let go of a shovel, since otherwise it falls over and gets the stuff you were shovelling onto the handle. So that just looked like a good piece of business showing Smith doing the most menial farm work and taking a break in a regular-guy way. The downward glance looked like a natural awkward response to meeting a stranger who seems bizarrely excited to meet you.

Gay people have often had to communicate subtly but I really don't think gay people are going around trying to send out sexual signals with such casual gestures, or reading invitations into everyday gestures from others. I think that's a homophobic anxiety that we shouldn't perpetuate. Flirting is a thing for all orientations but it doesn't work for anyone without being more overt than that.

The point that Joseph Smith fascinated his followers personally is no doubt real on the other hand. The film was bound to show that fascination if it was going to be at all realistic.

[Kishkumen]

Gay people have often had to communicate subtly but I really don't think gay people are going around trying to send out sexual signals with such casual gestures, or reading invitations into everyday gestures from others. I think that's a homophobic anxiety that we shouldn't perpetuate. Flirting is a thing for all orientations but it doesn't work for anyone without being more overt than that.

The point that Joseph Smith fascinated his followers personally is no doubt real on the other hand. The film was bound to show that fascination if it was going to be at all realistic.

There is homophobic anxiety and then there is interpretation of an art form. What we are doing is the latter, as we have no homophobic anxiety. We celebrate homoerotic attraction to Joseph Smith, both in his own day and in the present. If anyone is anxious about homosociality among the saints, it is the apologists, not us.

[Doctor Scratch]

I think that there are a couple of things that are worth remembering here. First: the Mopologists have a long and sordid history of virulent homophobia. Remember Louis Midgley's "You still selling books by that queer?" Remember Dan Peterson's homophobia in "Text and Context"? Second, the Reverend Kishkumen has said that the entire Witnesses movie is chock-full of instances like the one featured in this first clip. Is this genuinely a depiction of homoeroticism? Well, it would appear that there is room for debate, but if it is even remotely possible, then perhaps it points to what you were saying, Physics Guy, about "homophobic anxiety." Could it be that this sort of "anxiety" crept into the film production thanks to the Mopologists' hardcore biases? I think it's certainly possible.

As I said earlier: I will eagerly await further installments from "Interpreter." The more data we have, the better our evaluations will be.

[Dr Moore]

Keen eye, indeed.

From what I've read, Joseph was known for meeting people's gaze and looking deep into the souls of those he met. So why did the film director choose for Joseph to spend more time looking down at Oliver's junk at their first meeting? Very odd directorial liberty with this scene. A better scene would have featured a solid 10-15 seconds of tense, silent deep eye-gazing as Joseph assessed the stranger's soul.

It's as if either the actor, or the director (or both?), deliberately laid this "gay" Easter egg.

[Kishkumen]

Let’s say this is completely inadvertent. If so, I would have to call it some of the strangest dialogue and direction I have ever seen. It is almost like I am seeing some kind of blooper reel here. Who on earth would have this scene unfold as it does on purpose, unless . . . .

[Everybody Wang Chung]

The Church has always had an uneasy and sometimes conflicted relationship with homosexuality.


“For my first act as Mayor of this city I’m pleased to announce that the sodomy laws have been overturned, so now we can overturn each other.” Joseph Smith, Council of Fifty.


“When I was in the Nauvoo Legion, they gave me a medal for killing two men and a discharge for loving one.” Diary of Filbert Grimwal