President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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BeNotDeceived
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

Post by BeNotDeceived »

It's incredibly disgusting to me how this 'church' claims to be an advocate and defender for and of the unborn, yet, spends very little of its hundreds of billions fighting abortion or speaking out in condemnation of it while it builds and invests in Babylon. :oops: :x The hypocrisy that goes on with this real estate corporation masquerading as a religion is astounding and nauseating!
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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Because trillions upon trillions of souls will not end up in Outer Darkness and there be forever tormented according to Mormon theology.
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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John Larsen wrote:For a long time it was called the Plan of Salvation. And then they started calling it the Plan of Exaltation. The problem is salvation is kind not a very well defined word in Mormonism theologically.

There's a lot of others who use the phrase plan of salvation, so then they started calling it the plan of exaltation. Exaltation of course is when you become a God in Mormonism. That was used for a while but when you're trying to explain that to new people it's just as confusing as a Plan of Salvation if not more now what the church calls it is a Plan of Happiness.

We have to pick a point to start this story. When our heavenly father and our heavenly mother had achieved their exaltation. They had done everything they needed to do in their in their world. And they had come to the point where they had they had left their heavenly parents as a as an exalted couple. And they begin to do what their parents have done, which is repeat what has already been done on other worlds. Heavenly father is a franchisee.

Lucifer is like "oh fine I'm gonna take like one third of my brothers and sisters with me." Satan is just playing into the plan that he's not even for.

The next phase of our of this Plan of Salvation which is the conception. We have to start the conception with 150 or so billion people. The University of Utah gives a miscarriage rate of 25 percent. Also there is 1 abortion in the world for every 3.2 live births. So the total number of humans conceived that went to the womb or went to the earth is 145 billion.

We know from scripture that one third of the total didn't come to this planet, so then we have to bring those guys back in and that is 72 billion. For a grand total of 217 billion.

All 217 billion spirits are all going to come to this earth and they're going to sin. And Jesus says I will pay for everybody's sin. Clause 3 of your EULA down there: you're going to be the enemy of God the minute you're born until this planet. By your very nature you will be the enemy to God.
Mosiah 16:10:

"Even this mortal shall put on immortality, and this corruption shall put on incorruption, and shall be brought to stand before the bar of God, to be judged of him according to their works whether they be good or whether they be evil—

If they be good, to the resurrection of endless life and happiness; and if they be evil, to the resurrection of endless damnation, being delivered up to the devil, who hath subjected them, which is damnation."
Mosiah chapter 3 tells us that we're all evil and (let's read the first sentence of that) "for the natural man is an enemy to God. It has been from the Fall of Adam and will be forever unless he yields to the enticings of the Holy Spirit"

All right now we're going to get even further in the conundrum in Mormon theology. You don't receive the Holy Ghost until you've been baptized so Mosiah sets up this conundrum that one) by being born into this world by being a physical being you are the enemy of God and two) the only way to get back to God is if you are enticed (that's an active verb) by the Holy Spirit. But in Mormon theology you don't get the holy spirit until after you've been baptized. And it has been bestowed upon you.

You would only have the light of Christ but Mosiah doesn't say the light of Christ will entice you, Mosiah clearly says it must be the Holy Ghost that
entices you. So you were from the beginning in Jesus's plan you're going to be an enemy to God and God is not going to forget about that.

That idea that we're we're going to hell just because we're born unless the right sequence of events happens not to mention the fact that heavenly father is so bad at design that a third of his kids are like damned from the start. The host of heaven was 72 billion so there are 9.2 demons for every person walking around right now.

So we know 100 billion people were born on this planet but as it turns out 27 billion of the population never makes it past the year one. So of the 100 billion that have been born 27 billion would have died before they they they reached their first birthday. The second figure that researchers and anthropologists use is the age of 15 and I think it has to do with um development skeletal development and they do research on this and the estimate is that 47 percent of the global population never made it past 15. So if you made it past 15 from a from a global perspective you are already in the elite half half of everybody that was born here.

The majority of us, 75 percent, would either be the one-third host of heaven or they will have basically died before they made it past 15. The people who became adults on this planet are only one in four of all of the all of the spiritual that were born to heavenly father and mother.

It's Mormon doctrine that if you die before the age of eight you are not accountable for your sins you're. You're automatically going to the celestial kingdom if you die before the age of accountability. Kids are are better to be like killed before the age of eight than to become adults. If Jesus was right that narrow is the gate and few there be that find it that means all the rest of us, all the rest of us who actually survived were the unlucky ones because our chance of actually becoming a god is infinitesimal.

Remember Jesus's plan was that we would be judged by our works. That's very clear in Mormon theology. That we were coming here to be judged of our own action but the scriptures say we can't act unless we're enticed one way or the other. Alma says that and that that it also says that the only people who are good are those who the spirit enticed them to be good. So not only was the one-third sent here to tempt us the rest of us were sent here to die and be damned. Unless God interfered by sending the Holy Spirit to us. But Jesus said we can't interfere. If there is a member of that the lds church listening to this and they have a great argument of how this all makes sense please write it to me.

So now we're watching the spirit children jump down out of the pre-existence like paratroopers over Normandy. All these children coming down. Like one quarter of all babies die in utero. Boom boom boom boom. We're throwing spirits down. Most of them never make it down or they die at four months. Because remember I said the number of miscarriages with 33 billion.




Let's go through the Book of Mormon because the Book of Mormon is the most true and correct book of any book that has ever been written.
Mosiah 3:27 "And their torment is as a lake of fire and brimstone, whose flames are unquenchable, and whose smoke ascendeth up forever and ever. Thus hath the Lord commanded me. Amen."
First Nephi 14:3 "And that great pit, which hath been digged for them by that great and abominable church, which was founded by the devil and his children, that he might lead away the souls of men down to hell—yea, that great pit which hath been digged for the destruction of men shall be filled by those who digged it, unto their utter destruction, saith the Lamb of God; not the destruction of the soul, save it be the casting of it into that hell which hath no end."
Second Nephi 9 16 "And assuredly, as the Lord liveth, for the Lord God hath spoken it, and it is his eternal word, which cannot pass away, that they who are righteous shall be righteous still, and they who are filthy shall be filthy still; wherefore, they who are filthy are the devil and his angels; and they shall go away into everlasting fire, prepared for them; and their torment is as a lake of fire and brimstone, whose flame ascendeth up forever and ever and has no end."
Mormon 8:38 "O ye pollutions, ye hypocrites, ye teachers, who sell yourselves for that which will canker, why have ye polluted the holy church of God? Why are ye ashamed to take upon you the name of Christ? Why do ye not think that greater is the value of an endless happiness than that misery which never dies—because of the praise of the world?"
Helaman 5:12 "And now, my sons, remember, remember that it is upon the rock of our Redeemer, who is Christ, the Son of God, that ye must build your foundation; that when the devil shall send forth his mighty winds, yea, his shafts in the whirlwind, yea, when all his hail and his mighty storm shall beat upon you, it shall have no power over you to drag you down to the gulf of misery and endless wo, because of the rock upon which ye are built, which is a sure foundation, a foundation whereon if men build they cannot fall."
Jacob 6:10 "10 And according to the power of justice, for justice cannot be denied, ye must go away into that lake of fire and brimstone, whose flames are unquenchable, and whose smoke ascendeth up forever and ever, which lake of fire and brimstone is endless torment."
Alma 9:11 "Yea, and if it had not been for his matchless power, and his mercy, and his along-suffering towards us, we should unavoidably have been cut off from the face of the earth long before this period of time, and perhaps been consigned to a state of endless misery and woe."
You cannot have a Mormonism that doesn't believe in eternal punishment if you believe in the Book of Mormon. We just ignore all the inconvenient scriptures even though we're told they're scriptures in the word of God. God knew that he would put 72.5 billion souls into outer darkness. And his children that become Gods put their 72.5 billion souls into outer darkness. Billions upon Billions upon Trillions upon Trillions over and over and over and over endlessly.

I find this cosmology to be not just ridiculous but to be offensive. It is really a terrible thing. If it's true we only have one task: we have to hunt down the who whatever being started this and we have to kill it.
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Res Ipsa
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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I'm not seeing the "open season" part.
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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The Church has not favored or opposed legislative proposals or public demonstrations concerning abortion.
Has become
The Church’s position on this matter remains unchanged. As states work to enact laws related to abortion, Church members may appropriately choose to participate in efforts to protect life and to preserve religious liberty.
I'm sure everyone remembers how the church in 2008 was actively telling its members to campaign against gay marriage, even going to far as to help them cold call California voters.

In the wake of that bad publicity, the church backed off taking political positions and put the top message about abortion on their website for years. The top message can be considered the "soft" one which seeks to tell the world the church wants to stay out of the issue.

But now that the supreme court has reached its ruling, the LDS church is feeling its druthers again and is expressly telling members "we don't mind if you campaign to change the abortion laws in your state."

The Mormon church never banned members from campaigning against abortion, but now suddenly they want to remind members of that. Wink wink.
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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Why do you think “protect life” applies only to the fetus? Especially after discussing threats to the mother’s life?
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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Res Ipsa wrote:
Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:52 am
Why do you think “protect life” applies only to the fetus? Especially after discussing threats to the mother’s life?
Is the Church on record against protecting only post-fetal human lives? I don't see that in the statement quoted here. It seems to say that abortion is permissible in the Church's opinion if a "competent physician" determines that there are threats to the wombxn's "life or health." Or have I misread that in OP?
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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John Larsen wrote: I find this cosmology to be not just ridiculous but to be offensive. It is really a terrible thing. If it's true we only have one task: we have to hunt down the who whatever being started this and we have to kill it.
Ex-Mormon Redditors:

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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

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BeNotDeceived wrote:
Tue Jun 28, 2022 7:51 pm
It's incredibly disgusting to me how this 'church' claims to be an advocate and defender for and of the unborn, yet, spends very little of its hundreds of billions fighting abortion or speaking out in condemnation of it while it builds and invests in Babylon. :oops: :x The hypocrisy that goes on with this real estate corporation masquerading as a religion is astounding and nauseating!
This isn't quite the way I see it, but it does recall the strong contrast I experienced for the few years I lived in the south when I was in high school. Many of my friends, who were various shades of evangelical, all had very strong opinions about abortion, while I barely even knew what it was. I wasn't really even sure that the Church was generally opposed to it until I looked into Church manuals and asked around, etc. That is to say, it wasn't really discussed in public talks or in conferences to the point that I could be aware of it and what I was supposed to think about it. There weren't bumper stickers passed out to the congregation, and there were no trips to the March for Life etc. This is one of the many reasons why Mormons don't fit into the "religious right," in my view, and it is kind of puzzling on some levels. Doesn't abortion deny embodiment to pre-existent spirits? While Catholic opposition is understandable to me in the context of its natural law tradition, I have never really understood there to be much theological motivation for evangelical passions, but Mormonism seems to have actually definable reasons to oppose abortion (i.e. textually based and rooted in traditional Mormon belief). And yet it has always seemed kind of muted, and the fact that they spell out exceptions not only for the life but also the health of the mother sets them apart from other religious groups that their erstwhile allies.

This isn't a criticism one way or the other, and I don't have much interest in playing the hypocrisy game; it just seems like something in need of explanation.
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Re: President Newsroom declares open season on reproductive rights

Post by drumdude »

Res Ipsa wrote:
Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:52 am
Why do you think “protect life” applies only to the fetus? Especially after discussing threats to the mother’s life?
Because of this line:

“The Church teaches its members that even these rare exceptions do not justify abortion automatically.“

The church cannot even let members who are raped or in danger of death get an abortion without going through the bureaucracy. According to them the ultimate arbiter of life and death is a bishop or stake president who was called up from the lay congregation with zero training in medicine, psychology, or leadership.

God help any Mormon woman ignorant or brainwashed enough to put her life in their hands.
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