7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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drumdude
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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A Utah lawmaker and prominent attorney for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints advised a church bishop not to report a confession of child sex abuse to authorities, a decision that allowed the abuse to continue for years, according to records filed in a lawsuit.

The records — two pages from a log of calls fielded by a law firm representing the church and the deposition of a church official — show that Rep. Merrill F. Nelson, R-Grantsville, took the initial call from a bishop reporting that church member Paul Adams had sexually abused his daughters. Nelson also had multiple conversations over a two-year span with two bishops who knew of the abuse, the records show.

Nelson is a conservative lawmaker who was elected to the Utah House in 2013 and announced his retirement earlier this year. He was also a lawyer with the Salt Lake City firm Kirton McConkie, which represents the church. He earned his undergraduate and law degree from church-owned Brigham Young University.

A transcript of the deposition and excerpts of the call log were attached to a legal filing in the Arizona Court of Appeals made by lawyers for the plaintiffs. Three of Adams’ children are battling the Salt Lake City-based church for access to records the church insists are confidential. The church took the case to the Court of Appeals after a Cochise County judge ruled in favor of the victims.

According to the plaintiffs’ legal filing, Nelson advised lay Bishop John Herrod not to report the abuse and told him “that he could be sued if he reported, and the instruction by counsel not to report Paul to the authorities was the law in Arizona and had nothing to do with church doctrine.” But Arizona’s child sex abuse reporting law grants blanket legal immunity to anyone reporting child sex abuse or neglect.

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2022/09 ... ishop-not/
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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Rezendes continues digging. This morning's latest AP story in the ongoing series explores some of the history with churches abusing the clergy-penitent shield. This includes, more recently, LDS aggressively asserting political influence to prevent mandatory reporting bills from passing.

https://apnews.com/article/sex-abuse-ca ... 71323f6da3
“It’s difficult for me to tell this story without talking about the Mormons and their power in the Legislature,” Steele said. “What this boils down to is that the church is being given permission to protect the predators and the children be damned. … They are trying with all of their might to make sure this bill does not see the light of day.”
But supporters of the clergy privilege say abolishing it will not make children safer. Some go so far as to say that the ability of abusers to report privately to clergy encourages them to confess and often leads to stopping the abuse.

“When you take away every opportunity for people to get help, they go underground and the abuse continues,” Hill said.

But the authors of the study Hill cited, published in 2014, have cautioned about reaching such conclusions based on their research.

Frank Vandervort, a law professor at the University of Michigan, and his co-author, Vincent Palusci, a pediatrics professor at New York University, told the AP that the study was limited, partly because churches often wouldn’t give them access to data on clergy reporting.

“A single article should not be the basis for making policy decisions,” said Vandervort, lead author of the study. “It may be entirely the case that there’s no connection between the changing of the laws and the number of reports.”
“We have repeatedly asked the Legislature to strengthen reporting requirements in schools and religious institutions,” state Attorney General Hector Balderas told the AP. He said unreported child abuse is a major problem “resulting in tremendous amounts of trauma.”
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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Here's what Daniel wrote to a poster on Sic et Non who took issue with the LDS child abuse:
SeN Commenter wrote:I think (relatively soon) "the Church" will eliminate these humiliating, intrusive - sometimes abusive, sexually focused interviews. In fact, as I'm sure you are aware, major changes are already taking place. With interviews now being secretly recorded by those being called in, witnesses in the room - along with the person being interviewed and the growing legal liabilities, I don't think this disgusting practice will be long for the Handbook. I wonder - if even then - people like you who defend this stuff, will feel any shame, for what has been done. I kinda/sorta doubt it. I don't recall a single instance of Christ sitting down with a "sinner" and asking "tell me everything you did - in every intimate detail"...."I want and need to hear everything - before I can forgive you".
DCP wrote:With all of the feeling of my heart, I hope that the day comes -- perhaps in the dark and quiet of the night -- that your soul and conscience will be pricked with a degree of the shame you should feel for the arrogant and judgmental attitude that you're manifesting here. Oh yes, you'll attempt to hide and soothe yourself with the oft repeated words "I did this because I'm an exceptionally good and sensitive soul" or "I was expressing righteous indignation"; but those are just useless words, even if they come from someone who may actually believe such self-serving nonsense. I suspect that most if not all of us here are at least a little bit ashamed for you and for anybody else who acts in so complacently "superior" a way -- all because of an assumed moral superiority. Instead of accusing another of sin where there has been no sin, you should think of Christ's statement "he who is without sin, cast the first stone"....and "Go thy way, and sin no more". There is no defensible reason for you to have gone on the warpath with such vehement arrogance. If you possess any remaining human decency, you should abhor this repulsive behavior.
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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Well, members are free to believe they always have the morally superior high ground, by virtue of belonging to the one true and living church. I was guilty of taking that posture for some 40+ years of my own life, so I know where Dan and others who express similar outrage when the church's practices are revealed to be seriously wanting.

A predictable outcome of that mental model is that the church and its faithful members don't respond well to criticism of any kind. This would be fine if the criticism weren't justified, as some most certainly is. But the "one true and living" business model means that ALL criticism is resisted by the church, its leaders and loyal members.

That is why we see people leaving every time there's a scandal. I believe most people are inherently better than ANY institution which is structured to resist all criticism and label critics as enemies. One issue may not trigger everyone, but over time the compounding of issues that arise from this reinforced sense of structural inerrancy is bound to result in a smaller and less effective organization.

In some way, this reality was likely observed decades ago. I say that because the revelation narrative has shifted from individuals with keys and authority to councils and voting. But for all their business training, I'm dismayed that general authorities still haven't found a way to deeply integrate "loyal opposition" into the public discourse in Mormonism. It's a fatal flaw.
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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Most churches don’t claim that their ecclesiastical structure was set up as it is by God, personally and directly, and that keeping things run just that way is important to God. Even the Catholic Church is vaguer than Mormonism about just how God is supposed to guide the church on Earth.

So other churches are kind of like constitutional monarchies. There can be a loyal opposition because the thing to which people are loyal is not the government of the day but a more abstract ideal. The Mormon church, in contrast, is a presidential system. It doesn’t even seem to be a constitutional presidency, because the living prophet is supposed to override past revelation.

Ongoing revelation and a church structure set up by God are major Mormon selling points. Inherent totalitarianism is simply the flip side of that basic claim to be the one true church. So for Mormonism to allow loyal opposition would seem to be not reform but full-blown revolution.
I was a teenager before it was cool.
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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drumdude wrote:
Wed Sep 28, 2022 7:34 pm
Here's what Daniel wrote to a poster on Sic et Non who took issue with the LDS child abuse:
SeN Commenter wrote:I think (relatively soon) "the Church" will eliminate these humiliating, intrusive - sometimes abusive, sexually focused interviews. In fact, as I'm sure you are aware, major changes are already taking place. With interviews now being secretly recorded by those being called in, witnesses in the room - along with the person being interviewed and the growing legal liabilities, I don't think this disgusting practice will be long for the Handbook. I wonder - if even then - people like you who defend this stuff, will feel any shame, for what has been done. I kinda/sorta doubt it. I don't recall a single instance of Christ sitting down with a "sinner" and asking "tell me everything you did - in every intimate detail"...."I want and need to hear everything - before I can forgive you".
DCP wrote:With all of the feeling of my heart, I hope that the day comes -- perhaps in the dark and quiet of the night -- that your soul and conscience will be pricked with a degree of the shame you should feel for the arrogant and judgmental attitude that you're manifesting here. Oh yes, you'll attempt to hide and soothe yourself with the oft repeated words "I did this because I'm an exceptionally good and sensitive soul" or "I was expressing righteous indignation"; but those are just useless words, even if they come from someone who may actually believe such self-serving nonsense. I suspect that most if not all of us here are at least a little bit ashamed for you and for anybody else who acts in so complacently "superior" a way -- all because of an assumed moral superiority. Instead of accusing another of sin where there has been no sin, you should think of Christ's statement "he who is without sin, cast the first stone"....and "Go thy way, and sin no more". There is no defensible reason for you to have gone on the warpath with such vehement arrogance. If you possess any remaining human decency, you should abhor this repulsive behavior.
Yeesh. As I read that post, I got the sense that the poster was traumatized by such an experience. I can relate.

Responding to a person's trauma (whether you feel it is "justified" trauma or not) that they should feel shame is abhorrent and repulsive.

"Oh, you felt traumatizing shame? Well, you should feel shame for feeling that shame."

Defense of the Church doesn't mandate abandonment of compassion.
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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All that matters to DCP is defending the church at any cost.


“It is better that a few thousand commit suicide than a religion accept LGBT people.” 4th Nephi or there abouts.
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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Physics Guy wrote:
Thu Sep 29, 2022 6:51 am
Most churches don’t claim that their ecclesiastical structure was set up as it is by God, personally and directly, and that keeping things run just that way is important to God. Even the Catholic Church is vaguer than Mormonism about just how God is supposed to guide the church on Earth.

So other churches are kind of like constitutional monarchies. There can be a loyal opposition because the thing to which people are loyal is not the government of the day but a more abstract ideal. The Mormon church, in contrast, is a presidential system. It doesn’t even seem to be a constitutional presidency, because the living prophet is supposed to override past revelation.

Ongoing revelation and a church structure set up by God are major Mormon selling points. Inherent totalitarianism is simply the flip side of that basic claim to be the one true church. So for Mormonism to allow loyal opposition would seem to be not reform but full-blown revolution.
Totally agree. It may seem a subtle difference but you are spot on. I also think it will never change, even as the church's influence marginalizes with time. That outcome is also now part of the faith narrative, as Elder Cook has begun annotating into a prophecy of Nephi: "their numbers will be small, because of wickedness."

But, it's Mormonism. I am sure they'll figure out a productive work around, probably by harnessing the massive potential energy stored up in Ensign Peak.
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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The rules of the Kirton McConkie Fight Club shall be:

1. Don't blab so the abuse can continue.
2. Defend the abuser.
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Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: 7 years sex abuse of a child covered up by LDS leaders

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Moksha wrote:
Thu Sep 29, 2022 5:54 pm
The rules of the Kirton McConkie Fight Club shall be:

1. Don't blab so the abuse can continue.
2. Defend the abuser.
Does this make the Mormon church true or not true?

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Hugh Nibley claimed he bumped into Adolf Hitler, Albert Einstein, Winston Churchill, Gertrude Stein, and the Grand Duke Vladimir Romanoff. Dishonesty is baked into Mormonism.
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