Reliability of Witness Testimony

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drumdude
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Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by drumdude »

Here are 46 cases in which false eyewitness testimony put innocent people on death row:

https://files.deathpenaltyinfo.org/lega ... C2001A.pdf

Here is an experiment on how much people value eyewitness testimony:
To determine what role eyewitness testimony played in the courtroom, psychologist and memory expert Elizabeth Lofthus conducted an experiment in which subjects served as jurors in a mock trial. First, all jurors heard the same description of the crime, a hypothetical robbery and murder. In one version of the trial, the prosecutor presented only circumstantial evidence. Only 18 percent of the jurors found the defendant guilty. In the second version of the trial the prosecutor presented the same evidence with one addition—an eyewitness. Seventy-two percent of the jurors found the defendant guilty. This led Lofthus to conclude that jurors place enormous value on eyewitness testimony.

Studies have shown that mistaken eyewitness testimony accounts for about half of all wrongful convictions. Researchers at Ohio State University examined hundreds of wrongful convictions and determined that roughly 52 percent of the errors resulted from eyewitness mistakes. Legal scholar Edwin Borchard studied 65 cases of "erroneous criminal convictions of innocent people." Mistaken eyewitness identification was responsible for approximately 45 percent of Borchard's case studies.
https://www.crf-usa.org/bill-of-rights- ... ewitnesses

52 percent of all the innocent people convicted were the result of eyewitness testimony.


It's really interesting to see Daniel treat the testimony of the 11 witnesses as something akin to the apostles going out across the world to spread the Good News after Christ's death. There's just something about these 19th century men being led into a forest by a convicted treasure digger that doesn't seem to convince your average everyday thinking person. Especially when these people were so credulous as to follow Joseph into those same forests looking for ancient caches of gold... which mysteriously never materialized. Tell a thinking person that Joe used the same stone to look for treasure as to translate this 200lb golden book, and the person should be sufficiently inoculated against Mormon emotional manipulation.

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... heard.html
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by doubtingthomas »

drumdude wrote:
Mon Aug 08, 2022 12:50 am
Seventy-two percent of the jurors found the defendant guilty. This led Lofthus to conclude that jurors place enormous value on eyewitness testimony.
Jesus Christ.
drumdude wrote:
Mon Aug 08, 2022 12:50 am
It's really interesting to see Daniel treat the testimony of the 11 witnesses as something akin to the apostles going out across the world to spread the Good News after Christ's death.
11 superstitious witnesses can't possibly be wrong.
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IHAQ
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by IHAQ »

Witnesses also lie, especially when they have a vested interest in doing so.
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by High Spy »

IHAQ wrote:
Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:13 am
Witnesses also lie, especially when they have a vested interest in doing so.
Pic or it didn’t happen. :lol:
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by Moksha »

High Spy wrote:
Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:39 am
IHAQ wrote:
Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:13 am
Witnesses also lie, especially when they have a vested interest in doing so.
Pic or it didn’t happen. :lol:
Image
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by Res Ipsa »

We know that eyewitness evidence is unreliable and that juries think that it’s the most reliable type of evidence. And, the defense lawyers can’t inform the jury of that.
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by doubtingthomas »

Res Ipsa wrote:
Thu Aug 11, 2022 1:05 am
We know that eyewitness evidence is unreliable and that juries think that it’s the most reliable type of evidence. And, the defense lawyers can’t inform the jury of that.
Do you think there's another country with a better trial-by-jury system?
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Res Ipsa
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by Res Ipsa »

doubtingthomas wrote:
Thu Aug 11, 2022 7:40 am
Res Ipsa wrote:
Thu Aug 11, 2022 1:05 am
We know that eyewitness evidence is unreliable and that juries think that it’s the most reliable type of evidence. And, the defense lawyers can’t inform the jury of that.
Do you think there's another country with a better trial-by-jury system?
No idea.
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by huckelberry »

Res Ipsa wrote:
Thu Aug 11, 2022 1:05 am
We know that eyewitness evidence is unreliable and that juries think that it’s the most reliable type of evidence. And, the defense lawyers can’t inform the jury of that.
Res Ipsa, I would imagine (a question implied here) that a defense lawyer might observe how little familiarity a witness has with the accused and how other people likely have similar appearances.

I think the Book of Mormon witness have different limitation than those a witness identifying a individual in a crime has. For the Book of Mormon witness they simply had no way of knowing if the thing they were shown had the book written on them or if it was from ancient people.
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Rivendale
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Re: Reliability of Witness Testimony

Post by Rivendale »

Yet somehow James Strang's witnesses carry zero credibility in the apologetic world.
Strang's letter convinced several eminent Mormons of his claims, including Book of Mormon witnesses John and David Whitmer, Martin Harris and Hiram Page.[c] In addition Apostles John E. Page, William E. M'Lellin, and William Smith,[d] together with Nauvoo Stake President William Marks, and Bishop George Miller,[e] accepted Strang. Joseph Smith's mother, Lucy Mack Smith, and three of his sisters accepted Strang's claims. According to the Voree Herald, Strang's newspaper, Lucy Smith wrote to one Reuben Hedlock: "I am satisfied that Joseph appointed J.J. Strang. It is verily so."[26] According to Joseph Smith's brother William, all of his family (except for Hyrum and Samuel Smith's widows), endorsed Strang.[26]
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