How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

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drumdude
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How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by drumdude »

I'm curious among everyone here how you dealt with the belief that Hebrews were actually here in the Americas. In 600 BC.

I was a convert, and was introduced to Mormonism at the age of around 17. As soon as I heard the story that "Nephites" sailed to the Americas I knew that it wasn't possible. My heart sank a little, because these were such nice people teaching these things. They certainly focused on the simpler Christian message, and so it was easy to just set that small issue aside. As I moved along in Mormonism, I tried to treat it like the metaphorical stories of the flood, the garden of Eden, ect. But of course the Mormons around me made it nearly impossible to have or share a nuanced view of any of that.

How long did you guys struggle with the cognitive dissonance on this issue? Or was it not a big deal?
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by huckelberry »

drumdude, even though I was born and raised in the LDS church I find I might understand your view. I cannot remember exact times but I do not think the question crossed my concern before say Jr High school. At that time I thought of alternatives to belief but did not adopt skepticism. I became a concerned believer, pursuing newfound testimony about the time starting high school. I was more impressed with beliefs in Mormon thinking which I though superior to general Christian views. I thought LDS views were more positive about life and gave it more meaning. It encouraged learning and personal development. I was not terribly interested in the Book of Mormon. In fact with my first complete read through I found it to be disappointing. It had too much 19th century Protestant flavor.

I kind of wish that the blacks and priesthood question was at the front of my increasing problems with doubt. It resided on a back burner or even a shelf. The problem of the Book of Mormon as history was easier to face emotionally and probably fit my science geek inclinations. My belief in the Book of Mormon as a real history whose existence confirmed LDS priesthood authority went into painful collapse in my senior hs year. My connection with church activity ended with the escape to college.

////

I realize that the other issues, blacks (Negroes at that time) excluded from priesthood, polygamy, John Birch Society, overblown personal developement obsessions , age of earth, evolution, flood and other problems gnawed away at my confidence in LDS truth. It was the problem of Book of Mormon as history which was the focus that ended my belief consciously.
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Kishkumen
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by Kishkumen »

I don't think I was ever extremely committed to its historicity. I probably assumed it was historical when I was growing up. When I acquired my testimony of the Book of Mormon, I felt I knew it was true, but I did not consciously think in specifically historical terms about the question of truth. I got a strong witness of the Book of Mormon in 1988, and I more or less just thought it was an ancient book until I got some education under my belt at BYU. When I was in the process of graduating and moving away from BYU to go get my PhD, a fellow ward member asked if I was excited to learn more about the history of the Book of Mormon in my grad program, and it was at that point, in the year 1999, that I realized I had no real belief that the book was ancient at all. The whole idea sounded completely absurd to me at the time.

I remained active in the LDS Church for another 8 years or thereabouts. It really did not matter to me that the Book of Mormon is not an ancient work. To this day it does not matter. I don't think of the value of Mormonism hinging on the date of the Book of Mormon. I left the LDS Church for quite different reasons. The first step in my departure came with the Church's actions in connection with Prop 8 in California. The November Policy of more recent memory was the thing that convinced me I would never return.

At the end of the day, I don't think I was ever really that invested in the historicity of the Book of Mormon. As someone who studies ancient literature, and knows something about the history of the Bible, for example, I do not attach special significance to something being composed thousands of years ago. Mere date does not make something valuable or not.
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by doubtingthomas »

drumdude wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 9:05 pm
My heart sank a little, because these were such nice people teaching these things.
I bet a lot of girls (outside the US) fall in love with two tall white guys who are nice to them.
"I have the type of (REAL) job where I can choose how to spend my time," says Marcus. :roll:
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malkie
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by malkie »

doubtingthomas wrote:
Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:43 pm
drumdude wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 9:05 pm
My heart sank a little, because these were such nice people teaching these things.
I bet a lot of girls (outside the US) fall in love with two tall white guys who are nice to them.
In our little branch in Scotland, during the time that I was BP, we had an all-sister district - 3 or 4 pairs of young ladies, most of whom were not British, and none of whom were Scottish.

They often had (almost all male) investigators at church, and "converted" several. Most fell away when "their" sisters moved on, leaving us with yet more inactive people. But a few of those who didn't revert to their previous religions (The Churches of Bingo, Drinking, and Fitba') became really strong members.

So, yes, a lot of girls are happy when two decent guys are nice to them; on the flip side, a lot of guys are pleased when two pleasant young women are nice to them.

We had some really lively ones (sister missionaries, that is). And some exceptionally pretty ones too.
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by doubtingthomas »

malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:55 am

In our little branch in Scotland, during the time that I was BP, we had an all-sister district - 3 or 4 pairs of young ladies, most of whom were not British, and none of whom were Scottish.

They often had (almost all male) investigators at church, and "converted" several.
I would be their best investigator. :lol:
malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:55 am
So, yes, a lot of girls are happy when two decent guys are nice to them; on the flip side, a lot of guys are pleased when two pleasant young women are nice to them.
I bet a lot of guys who join the church are simply looking for a girl.
malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:55 am
So, yes, a lot of girls are happy when two decent guys are nice to them; on the flip side, a lot of guys are pleased when two pleasant young women are nice to them.
Do you think a lot of teenage guys join the church because they like a sister missionary?
"I have the type of (REAL) job where I can choose how to spend my time," says Marcus. :roll:
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malkie
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by malkie »

doubtingthomas wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:51 am
malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:55 am

In our little branch in Scotland, during the time that I was BP, we had an all-sister district - 3 or 4 pairs of young ladies, most of whom were not British, and none of whom were Scottish.

They often had (almost all male) investigators at church, and "converted" several.
I would be their best investigator. :lol:
malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:55 am
So, yes, a lot of girls are happy when two decent guys are nice to them; on the flip side, a lot of guys are pleased when two pleasant young women are nice to them.
I bet a lot of guys who join the church are simply looking for a girl.
malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:55 am
So, yes, a lot of girls are happy when two decent guys are nice to them; on the flip side, a lot of guys are pleased when two pleasant young women are nice to them.
Do you think a lot of teenage guys join the church because they like a sister missionary?
Sorry - I seem to have created a derail here, so I won't continue this side-issue beyond mentioning that it was mostly non-teenage guys who responded well to the sisters.

(thanks to MG and RI for bringing the problem of derails to the forefront again - Me to myself: stop!! just stop!)
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doubtingthomas
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by doubtingthomas »

malkie wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:59 am
it was mostly non-teenage guys who responded well to the sisters.
I see, they were probably very lonely. I guess sister missionaries are having a lot of success here in the US, there's a record number of young guys (under 25) who are single. The number seems to be getting bigger every year.
"I have the type of (REAL) job where I can choose how to spend my time," says Marcus. :roll:
Father Francis
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by Father Francis »

I was BIC and raised in a very conservative LDS household. I believed in the Book of Mormon as an actual ancient history from the time I can remember until I was about 16. It was the things I was taught in history and science classes that caused me to question. I've always had a penchant for science. I used to read the encyclopedia for fun at a young age. Anyways, the Book of Mormon narrative didn't add up.A year or two after I left the church I decided to look up the Book of Abraham and see if Joseph Smith got the translations of the facsimiles right. I even read the FARMS/FAIR apologetics and was unimpressed. The fact is, Joseph Smith claimed he could translate the hieroglyphs. He couldn't, and no mental gymnastics can get past that fact. That's when I knew for sure it was a bunch of nonsense.
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Re: How long/intensely did you believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon?

Post by Res Ipsa »

I believed absolutely until I parted company with the church at age 19.
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