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Dr. Peterson is fond of talking about his mission experience. He’s spoken frequently, in fact, about several moments of “bashing,” for example. Just recently, he posted a blog entry in which he discussed an encounter with a man who asked him and his companion if they spoke Greek, and Young Peterson whipped a mini Greek Bible out of his pocket! This effectively silenced the guy, evidently, and we can see the beginnings of a Mopologist in this anecdote. (DCP notes at the end that he thought he guy was a “bully.”)

This story is typical of DCP’s reminiscences about his mission, and I have to admit that, as the B.H. Roberts Chair, I’m embarrassed that I never inquired into the question of Dr. Peterson’s successful conversions. And it turns out that I—or somebody—should have:

DCP wrote:I baptized nobody in Switzerland -- though that's a bit too simple. I couldn't tell you whether any of those in whose conversions I participated are still active.

Whoa! I’d say this was stunning, except it’s not. I mean, if a smarmy, arrogant, prematurely balding young American showed up on your doorstep with a Book of Mormon in his hand, how would you react? But it’s also a remarkable admission, and it really speaks volumes. How many people, total, did the Mopologists convert on their missions? How many did Gee baptize? What about Midgley? It seems to me that this is a vital question, and the answer may explain a lot about why the Mopologists have leaned so aggressively into other metrics: e.g., how many PhDs are Mormons? How many weeks in a row has Interpreter posted a blog entry? And so on.

But this is not the same a baptizing someone into the Church. This truly is one of the most shocking admissions I’ve ever seen from Dr. Peterson.

How many did Smoot baptize? He’s spent the past 3-4 years trying to drive Neville and the Heartlanders out of the Church, so how does that figure into the overall calculus?

What about Scott Gordon? What were his conversion figures like? What about Hamblin? Welch? How does one ultimately calculate the value of “defending” the Church versus bringing people into Christ’s Church?

Dr. Scratch,

That’s very interesting.

I’m not surprised that DCP’s arrogance, condescending attitude and outright contempt for most people didn’t equate to success in the mission field.

What I would really be interested to know is how many people have left the Church as a direct result of DCP’s actions. I’m confident the number would be substantial.

ETA: At least DCP was able to learn perfect German on his mission and come back with a strange accent for the rest of his life.

Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:49 am

Dr. Scratch,

That’s very interesting.

I’m not surprised that DCP’s arrogance, condescending attitude and outright contempt for most people didn’t equate to success in the mission field.

What I would really be interested to know is how many people have left the Church as a direct result of DCP’s actions. I’m confident the number would be substantial.

He refers to “conversions” in which he “participated”. I interpret that to mean that a more earnest fellow elder did all the hard work, but Young DCP was happy to claim at least part of the victory for himself.

Well, if mere “contact” is all it takes, then I would estimate that the number of people he’s driven away is in the tens of thousands.

Doctor Scratch wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:53 am

Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:49 am

Dr. Scratch,

That’s very interesting.

I’m not surprised that DCP’s arrogance, condescending attitude and outright contempt for most people didn’t equate to success in the mission field.

What I would really be interested to know is how many people have left the Church as a direct result of DCP’s actions. I’m confident the number would be substantial.

He refers to “conversions” in which he “participated”. I interpret that to mean that a more earnest fellow elder did all the hard work, but Young DCP was happy to claim at least part of the victory for himself.

Well, if mere “contact” is all it takes, then I would estimate that the number of people he’s driven away is in the tens of thousands.

After all these years, posts regarding the DCP brand still get the clicks.
834 page views in about an hour from only two members posting.
Haven't been around much lately but that must be some kind of record.
Considering DCP's internet persona, I fully agree that he must have significant responsibility for many thousands of deconversions.
If his baptism denominator really is zero, then his damage ratio is unbounded.
The weight that broke a thousand shelves so to speak.
His online behavior certainly helped seal my departure and harden my adverse view of what the LDS Church has become in this century.
___________________

ETA: Some 300 or so more views of so in last 20 minutes. Now 1157 views at ~11:30 pm ET
Controversial guy. Sort of like a Mormon Trump.

I remember showing DCP's Mormon Stories interview to someone who was a non-member in order to give them some idea of what Mormonism was about and its good qualities.


That person could only stand about 5 minutes of it and then kindly asked me if we could stop listening to it.

I don't know if this is in Dr. Peterson's defense or not, but I served in the Zurich, Switzerland mission in the 90s. It wasn't uncommon for missionaries to go home with the cliché of having had one conversion - themselves. There were months when the mission recorded zero baptisms...that's zero for the entire mission. One missionary was considered a rock star for being involved in a baptism every month for a long period of time and then was made an AP which I think broke his streak. The Zurich 1st Ward wasn't easy proselytizing.

After having the mission president attend the third baptism I had been part of in three months, he said something to me about noticing my involvement and asked what my secret was. I couldn't take credit for any of it really and said, "Just being in the right place at the right time." My impression was he thought it was more spiritual than I meant it. But that was the mission field in Switzerland. Investigators could be on teaching schedules for years then decide to get baptized as one of those three did. The other two were member contacts I just got lucky enough to teach. We taught a temple square contact who was baptized, a family member of an investigator who made the decision to get baptized while I was in the area. We train contacted a gentleman who was baptized (genuinely good guy and I hope he is doing well), and a young woman we met while contacting on the street. Only taught one person we met while going door to door who was baptized and that happened the month after I finished my mission. Got a letter from them thanking us for finding them. I felt pretty insignificant in that process.

I went home feeling pretty successful as far as Swiss missionaries went and I really didn't feel it had much to do with me at all. It's a tough mission if your metric is baptisms.

ETA: Our mission president was one of the most genuinely Christian Mormons I ever met in my life. I bring that up because I heard from many friends about their hard selling business MPs and was grateful we had the delightful couple we did. Amazing people. That he never became a GA to my knowledge is evidence against the Church being true.

He could also subscribe to the "plant the seed theory" -- "who knows" how many would eventually convert one day from that tract or first discussion, or even that Bible bash. Can't you see him believing that somebody he ridiculed in debate came to believe that he was right all along and eventually got baptized?

Didn't that guy Midgley pummeled in class become active in church later in life and didn't Midgley imply that this was because of the lesson he beat into him?

honorentheos wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 15, 2022 4:39 am

I don't know if this is in Dr. Peterson's defense or not, but I served in the Zurich, Switzerland mission in the 90s. It wasn't uncommon for missionaries to go home with the cliché of having had one conversion - themselves. There were months when the mission recorded zero baptisms...that's zero for the entire mission.
...

Same thing with Scotland. Mormons were not popular at all.

Also, Mormonism had a hard time competing with the dominant local religions:

• Drinking
• Bingo
• Fitba'

(not in any particular order)

honorentheos wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 15, 2022 4:39 am

I don't know if this is in Dr. Peterson's defense or not, but I served in the Zurich, Switzerland mission in the 90s. It wasn't uncommon for missionaries to go home with the cliché of having had one conversion - themselves. There were months when the mission recorded zero baptisms...that's zero for the entire mission.

Did that prompt angry visits and admonitions from General Authorities?