Happy Sunday

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
User avatar
Kishkumen
God
Posts: 6107
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:37 pm
Location: Cassius University

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by Kishkumen »

malkie wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 2:14 am
Kishkumen wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 2:07 am
...
Thank you for sharing that story from your life, malkie. Ι don’t recall reading it here before.
...
I was referring to a social media interaction in which you put into words a feeling I had been struggling to express.
Oh! OK. I always get a kick out of running into you in both places. You are a valued friend.
“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”~Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
User avatar
malkie
God
Posts: 1476
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 2:41 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by malkie »

Kishkumen wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 2:16 am
malkie wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 2:14 am

I was referring to a social media interaction in which you put into words a feeling I had been struggling to express.
Oh! OK. I always get a kick out of running into you in both places. You are a valued friend.
Thank you for the kind words. I feel honoured that you count me as a friend.
You can help Ukraine by talking for an hour a week!! PM me, or check www.enginprogram.org for details.
Слава Україні!, 𝑺𝒍𝒂𝒗𝒂 𝑼𝒌𝒓𝒂𝒊𝒏𝒊!
Jack T
Nursery
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2022 12:57 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by Jack T »

dastardly stem wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:01 pm
Welcome. There are at least 2 things I can agree with you on right off the bat. I’m an atheist to whatever extent that word Carrie’s meaning and I’m at least concerned and perplexed by the exmembers who fawn over Dehlin, and frankly disappointed in plenty of what Dehlin has to say. Other than that I’d imagine a good deal of disagreement. I don’t know if remember Atlanticmike too much as he flew in here kinda angry and unwilling to engage, but I read him as pretty far right as I recall. I’d wonder how anyone takes it further. Sounds like I may have misread him.
In the previous week, I listen to five episodes of Mormon stories, the most recent of which was titled race and Mormon scripture. In the first 10 minutes of that show, the guest and John both of whom are white, characterize any person who doesn't have white skin as a marginalized person. Given that John is supposed to be a psychologist, it was really sad to hear. It begs the question of why a certified psychologist would you skin tone to assess marginalization.

In my perspective, if you go through life labeling someone or a group of people as marginalized based on their skin tone in the year 2022, you are no different from the Mormon Church's brethren in the years prior to 1978. John feels justified in his treatment of POC since he operates inside a woke ideological framework. However, racism is racism, regardless of whether someone believes their motivations are good. Isn't telling POC repeatedly that they are marginalized and that white people must assist them in order for them to achieve in 2022 the same as telling black people that they cannot hold the priesthood in 1978?

You made a poor assessment of Mike. He's not even close to being on the far right. His opinions on the LGBT community are a good place to start they are probably more liberal than most here. There's other stuff too.
Marcus
God
Posts: 4996
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:44 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by Marcus »

Jack T wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 11:37 am
...You made a poor assessment of Mike. He's not even close to being on the far right. His opinions on the LGBT community are a good place to start they are probably more liberal than most here. There's other stuff too.
This makes me wonder if you have read much, if any, of what atlanticmike posted here.
User avatar
Res Ipsa
God
Posts: 9521
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:44 pm
Location: Playing Rabbits

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by Res Ipsa »

Jack T wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 11:37 am
dastardly stem wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:01 pm
Welcome. There are at least 2 things I can agree with you on right off the bat. I’m an atheist to whatever extent that word Carrie’s meaning and I’m at least concerned and perplexed by the exmembers who fawn over Dehlin, and frankly disappointed in plenty of what Dehlin has to say. Other than that I’d imagine a good deal of disagreement. I don’t know if remember Atlanticmike too much as he flew in here kinda angry and unwilling to engage, but I read him as pretty far right as I recall. I’d wonder how anyone takes it further. Sounds like I may have misread him.
In the previous week, I listen to five episodes of Mormon stories, the most recent of which was titled race and Mormon scripture. In the first 10 minutes of that show, the guest and John both of whom are white, characterize any person who doesn't have white skin as a marginalized person. Given that John is supposed to be a psychologist, it was really sad to hear. It begs the question of why a certified psychologist would you skin tone to assess marginalization.

In my perspective, if you go through life labeling someone or a group of people as marginalized based on their skin tone in the year 2022, you are no different from the Mormon Church's brethren in the years prior to 1978. John feels justified in his treatment of POC since he operates inside a woke ideological framework. However, racism is racism, regardless of whether someone believes their motivations are good. Isn't telling POC repeatedly that they are marginalized and that white people must assist them in order for them to achieve in 2022 the same as telling black people that they cannot hold the priesthood in 1978?

You made a poor assessment of Mike. He's not even close to being on the far right. His opinions on the LGBT community are a good place to start they are probably more liberal than most here. There's other stuff too.
Hi Jack. “Marginalized” is simply a description. For example, black folks could fairly be described as “marginalized” within the LDS Church before 1978 because the men couldn’t hold any position of authority. The priesthood ban was a rule that discriminated based on race. Marginalized is a word that describes the result of the discriminatory rule.

The rule has been gone for 45 years. If we look at the governance structure of the LDS Church and see it dominated by whites men today in way that is significantly disproportionate to the racial composition of church membership, then we could use the term marginalized to describe non-white folks in terms of church leadership.

But the term “marginalized” Is just a description. What, if anything should be done about it is an entirely different question.
he/him
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.

Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
User avatar
Moksha
God
Posts: 5777
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:13 am
Location: Koloburbia

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by Moksha »

Jack T wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 11:37 am
In my perspective, if you go through life labeling someone or a group of people as marginalized based on their skin tone in the year 2022, you are no different from the Mormon Church's brethren in the years prior to 1978.
Perhaps he is observing what has happened, rather than dictating that it should happen.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
huckelberry
God
Posts: 2556
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:48 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by huckelberry »

Marcus wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 2:44 pm
Jack T wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 11:37 am
...You made a poor assessment of Mike. He's not even close to being on the far right. His opinions on the LGBT community are a good place to start they are probably more liberal than most here. There's other stuff too.
This makes me wonder if you have read much, if any, of what atlanticmike posted here.
But curiously Jack has an identical concept of what racism is.
MG 2.0
God
Posts: 3628
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2021 4:45 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by MG 2.0 »

malkie wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:18 am

The first big crack in my beliefs came at that time when I realised that I simply didn't miss going to church in the way I thought I would and should. I started searching for what could make me feel that way. My search eventually led me to the website of Richard Packham, a retired teacher & lawyer. It was all downhill from there.
It’s interesting the order that these two things occurred.

Regards,
MG
User avatar
Rivendale
God
Posts: 1152
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:21 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by Rivendale »

malkie wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:18 am
Kishkumen wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:40 pm


The first big crack in my beliefs came at that time when I realised that I simply didn't miss going to church in the way I thought I would and should. I started searching for what could make me feel that way. My search eventually led me to the website of Richard Packham, a retired teacher & lawyer. It was all downhill from there.
That man is amazing. He is still active on Reddit occasionally. He sacrificed everything on his path to debunking Mormonism. I especially like his story about his wine adventure.
dastardly stem
God
Posts: 2259
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 2:38 pm

Re: Happy Sunday

Post by dastardly stem »

Jack T wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 11:37 am


In the previous week, I listen to five episodes of Mormon stories, the most recent of which was titled race and Mormon scripture. In the first 10 minutes of that show, the guest and John both of whom are white, characterize any person who doesn't have white skin as a marginalized person. Given that John is supposed to be a psychologist, it was really sad to hear. It begs the question of why a certified psychologist would you skin tone to assess marginalization.

In my perspective, if you go through life labeling someone or a group of people as marginalized based on their skin tone in the year 2022, you are no different from the Mormon Church's brethren in the years prior to 1978. John feels justified in his treatment of POC since he operates inside a woke ideological framework. However, racism is racism, regardless of whether someone believes their motivations are good. Isn't telling POC repeatedly that they are marginalized and that white people must assist them in order for them to achieve in 2022 the same as telling black people that they cannot hold the priesthood in 1978?
No. Not the same.
You made a poor assessment of Mike. He's not even close to being on the far right. His opinions on the LGBT community are a good place to start they are probably more liberal than most here. There's other stuff too.
We’ll good for him.
“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find another.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
Post Reply