New Podcasts on the Weird and Incoherent Mormon God(s)

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Shulem
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Re: New Podcasts on the Weird and Incoherent Mormon God(s)

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Philo Sofee wrote:
Sun Nov 27, 2022 1:15 am
Heh..... yer sounding a lot what I think....we're weird pal..... :D

Yep, and we are on it. You and me bro, we've got Mormonism in the palm of our hand and can look at it and judge it for what for it is and what it's not.

Woooohooooo!!!!
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Jehovah (?)

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Philo (u still there?),

Reference, Podcast 7; 14:50 (origins of the name Jehovah, sources E & J)

I have a question and was wondering what your thoughts were on a particular point with reference to the name JEHOVAH spelled out in the KJV of Exodus. As you know, Smith changed Ex 6:3 to allow the name Jehovah as a name used previous to Moses' time.

Exodus 6:3 KJV wrote:And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them.
Exodus 6:3 JST wrote:And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob. I am the Lord God Almighty; the Lord JEHOVAH. And was not my name known unto them?

The actual manuscript for the JST Exodus 6:3 is here: Old Testament Revision 2

Anyway, as you know, Smith depended heavily on the Adam Clarke Commentary and I think he employed the (?) for the JST based on suggestion in the commentary for Verse 3:

Adam Clarke wrote:But by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them. — This passage has been a sort of crux criticorum, and has been variously explained. It is certain that the name Jehovah was in use long before the days of Abraham, see Genesis 2:4, where the words יהוה אלהים Jehovah Elohim occur, as they do frequently afterwards; and see Genesis 15:2, where Abraham expressly addresses him by the name Adonai JEHOVAH; and see Genesis 15:7, where God reveals himself to Abraham by this very name: And he said unto him, I am JEHOVAH, that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees. How then can it be said that by his name JEHOVAH he was not known unto them? Several answers have been given to this question; the following are the chief: -

1. The words should be read interrogatively, for the negative particle לא lo, not, has this power often in Hebrew. "I appeared unto Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob by the name of God Almighty, and by my name Jehovah was I not also made known unto them?"

So, do you think Smith borrowed from No. 1 comment and therefore changed the verse and added the question mark (?) based on Clarke's observation? Thoughts?
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Re: New Podcasts on the Weird and Incoherent Mormon God(s)

Post by Philo Sofee »

Another podcast of some research I did into Joseph Smith's problematic definition of God in the Lectures on Faith. I hope you all enjoy the listen. It's only 28 minutes. This is No. 8 in the new podcast series.
https://backyardprofessor.org/2022/11/b ... on-of-god/
Last edited by Philo Sofee on Sun Nov 27, 2022 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jehovah (?)

Post by Philo Sofee »

Shulem wrote:
Sun Nov 27, 2022 3:28 pm
Philo (u still there?),

Reference, Podcast 7; 14:50 (origins of the name Jehovah, sources E & J)

I have a question and was wondering what your thoughts were on a particular point with reference to the name JEHOVAH spelled out in the KJV of Exodus. As you know, Smith changed Ex 6:3 to allow the name Jehovah as a name used previous to Moses' time.

Exodus 6:3 KJV wrote:And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them.
Exodus 6:3 JST wrote:And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob. I am the Lord God Almighty; the Lord JEHOVAH. And was not my name known unto them?

The actual manuscript for the JST Exodus 6:3 is here: Old Testament Revision 2

Anyway, as you know, Smith depended heavily on the Adam Clarke Commentary and I think he employed the (?) for the JST based on suggestion in the commentary for Verse 3:

Adam Clarke wrote:But by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them. — This passage has been a sort of crux criticorum, and has been variously explained. It is certain that the name Jehovah was in use long before the days of Abraham, see Genesis 2:4, where the words יהוה אלהים Jehovah Elohim occur, as they do frequently afterwards; and see Genesis 15:2, where Abraham expressly addresses him by the name Adonai JEHOVAH; and see Genesis 15:7, where God reveals himself to Abraham by this very name: And he said unto him, I am JEHOVAH, that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees. How then can it be said that by his name JEHOVAH he was not known unto them? Several answers have been given to this question; the following are the chief: -

1. The words should be read interrogatively, for the negative particle לא lo, not, has this power often in Hebrew. "I appeared unto Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob by the name of God Almighty, and by my name Jehovah was I not also made known unto them?"

So, do you think Smith borrowed from No. 1 comment and therefore changed the verse and added the question mark (?) based on Clarke's observation? Thoughts?
I think the reliance on Clark appears pretty good...
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Re: Jehovah (?)

Post by Shulem »

Philo Sofee wrote:
Sun Nov 27, 2022 6:24 pm
I think the reliance on Clark appears pretty good...

I'll bet Adam Clarke's commentary about the New Testament Christian God as it relates to the Old Testament God is exactly what Smith used for his views of the Book of Mormon Trinitarian God. Smith was dependent on Clarke, was he not? "Borrowed robes!" The furthest thing from Smith's mind at that time was the idea that the Father and Son were separate personages both having their own bodies of flesh and bone. Anything Smith ever related to others (including his own mother) about his first visionary experience was how the "Lord of glory" appeared to him as the Father and Son -- being one person. Had Joseph described two separate persons to his parents and others, he would have gotten his ass whipped. We would have heard about it because there would be a record of the controversy! To see Christ was to see the Father. That is basic Christian doctrine beginning with mortal Jesus's ministry and into his resurrection. Smith carried that idea straight into his Book of Mormon culminating with the grand appearance of the Lord of glory to the Nephites after his resurrection.

I think this would make for an excellent project in studying the comparisons between Adam Clarke and Smith's Book of Mormon and early revelations. This particular study is still in its infancy and surely there are some amazing discoveries yet to be determined and uncovered, do you think?

Makes me wonder what I might find if I dig deeper.
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