The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

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IHAQ
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The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

Post by IHAQ »

The Supreme Court will once again turn its attention to LGBTQ rights and religion on Monday when it hears a case brought by a web designer who, for religious reasons, does not want to design wedding websites for same-sex couples.

In 303 Creative v. Elenis, designer Lorie Smith argues that a Colorado nondiscrimination law violates her free speech rights by preventing her from being upfront about her religious beliefs and forcing her to create websites that imply support for gay marriage.

“Colorado is censoring and compelling my speech,” she recently told The Associated Press. “Forcing me to communicate, celebrate and create for messages that go against my deeply held beliefs.”
https://www.deseret.com/faith/2022/12/3 ... s-religion
Smith and her supporters argue that a win for Colorado officials would allow policies like the Colorado Anti-Discrimination Act to trump other important protections, harming people of faith in the process. Business owners who don’t support same-sex marriage would have to choose between living out their beliefs and thriving in their careers, claims a brief from a group of religious organizations, including The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
For anyone who still harboured a hope that the Church had changed, this case shows they are still actively supporting discrimination against LGBQT.

A link to the briefing document mentioned above:
https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/ ... Saints.pdf
Lorie Smith occupies, or should occupy, a special place in our public discourse—a genuine religious dissident. See Wisconsin v. Yoder, 406 U.S. 205, 226 (1972) (“Even their idiosyncratic separateness exem- plifies the diversity we profess to admire and encourage.”). With malice toward no one, she is bravely defying strong popular opinion to remain true to her con- science. In that, she joins an honorable tradition of religious dissent—a tradition stretching back to the Greek tragedy of Antigone. That same tradition includes a biblical account of three men who would not bow to the king’s image. See Daniel 3:18 (KJV). Colorado does not threaten to hurl Smith into a “burning fiery furnace.” Id. But the State does seek to compel her and her business to produce messages that violate her conscience and to censor her religious speech. And that the Constitution forbids.
The problem, as I see it, is that Lorie Smith has offered to provide a service to the general public, and it is within that sphere that discrimination has to be outlawed. If she is allowed to discriminate based on religious beliefs then America has not learned from the "Whites Only" era where discrimination based upon belief can now be seen to be horrific racism. Lorie Smith should addd a headline to her website saying "Straights Only" so as not to mislead the general public about the service she is offering. I mean, if she believes in being honest that is...

From the website designers own website:
to my clients
I am very sorry that some people are so intolerant of my beliefs – beliefs shared by many Jews, Muslims, Christians, and nonreligious people in this country and the throughout the world. As you know, I try to treat everyone with respect and I wish they would do the same. Please contact me if you have concerns.
https://303creative.com/contact/
...said the person, with no hint of irony, who wants to discriminate against couples who believe in same sex marriages.

It will be interesting to see where this case ends up. But make no mistake, the Church is still actively supporting Prop 8 type initiatives, but is doing with less noise to avoid attracting unwanted attention.
IHAQ
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

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One particularly ardent supporter of a society with sexuality based apartheid says...
Religious liberty is a bedrock principle for me, as indeed it ought to be for anybody who affirms the Constitution of the United States of America and the first element of the First Amendment to that Constitution, which is the first part of the Bill of Rights.

This is fundamental.

And, if I see religious freedom seriously threatened — whether the threat be aimed at my own faith or at Muslims or at anybody else — trust me: I’ll be out on the barricades.
Link

Manning the barricades?

If this amicus brief succeeds, where will the right to discriminate against LGBQT end? There will be cafes and shops with signs that say "Straights Only", Uber drivers refusing to pick up "non-straights" etc. We've been here before, only last time it was a skin colour based discrimination. Why does religion never learn from the past? Christopher Hitchens was on to something...
drumdude
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

Post by drumdude »

First they came for the Mormon polygamists in 1890, and I said nothing.

Then they came for the Mormon racists in 1978, and I said nothing.

Then they came for the Mormon homophobes in 2022, and I said nothing.


(This is literally the garbage DCP put on his blog about the issue. Comparing himself and his persecuted religion to Holocaust victims again.)
dastardly stem
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

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Read American Crusade
Seidel examines some of the key Supreme Court cases of the last thirty years—including Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission (a bakery that refused to make a wedding cake for a gay couple)
Under the guise of religious freedom the religionists are attempting to weaponize things like free speech and religious freedom against their fellow Americans. And the supreme court, thanks to its Christian majority, has been a useful tool to that end in recent times.
“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find another.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

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dastardly stem wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 3:07 pm
Read American Crusade
Seidel examines some of the key Supreme Court cases of the last thirty years—including Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission (a bakery that refused to make a wedding cake for a gay couple)
Under the guise of religious freedom the religionists are attempting to weaponize things like free speech and religious freedom against their fellow Americans. And the supreme court, thanks to its Christian majority, has been a useful tool to that end in recent times.

This. So much this.
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Moksha
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

Post by Moksha »

What would the LDS Church's stance be if the web designer wished to refuse their service to Mormons?
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IHAQ
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

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Moksha wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 3:38 pm
What would the LDS Church's stance be if the web designer wished to refuse their service to Mormons?
They’d cry “Persecution!”
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jlamothe
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

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Moksha wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 3:38 pm
What would the LDS Church's stance be if the web designer wished to refuse their service to Mormons?
I was just about to say that I'm refusing to provide web development services to homophobes under the same rationale. You can't have it both ways.
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Doctor Steuss
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

Post by Doctor Steuss »

If Apple were to suddenly refuse to sell any of their products to Mormons, or refuse to carry any religious apps, or apps made by Mormons, I for some reason doubt that the LDS Church and would openly support Tim Cook's decision.

Maybe I'm wrong though.


ETA: Sorry, I should have ready the responses past the OP, as I now see I'm being redundant.
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jlamothe
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Re: The Church supports website developers LGBQT discrimination

Post by jlamothe »

Doctor Steuss wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 5:33 pm
If Apple were to suddenly refuse to sell any of their products to Mormons, or refuse to carry any religious apps, or apps made by Mormons, I for some reason doubt that the LDS Church and would openly support Tim Cook's decision.

Maybe I'm wrong though.


ETA: Sorry, I should have ready the responses past the opening post, as I now see I'm being redundant.
It's amazing how short-sighted these "prophets, seers and revelators" can be. One might even say "myopic".
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