Jesus is the reason baby

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Kishkumen
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Re: Jesus is the reason baby

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Thanks for the recommendation, Philo! Sounds like worthwhile reading. I am a little surprised that anyone would think being a person was a necessary part of being or becoming divine. Maybe among LDS that might be an assumption? The connection between a human past and divine future was first made by Euhemerus as far as we know, If I recall correctly. He lived in the Hellenistic era.
“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”~Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
dastardly stem
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Re: Jesus is the reason baby

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Philo Sofee wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 3:07 pm
dastardly stem wrote:
Tue Dec 20, 2022 5:05 pm
I'd think the most likely of these 3 Baal was never said to be a real person. Some have speculated that both Osiris and Inanna were at one time real people, some even think Osiris was an early Pharoah, of sorts. Most, no doubt, suggest, to keep it simple, none of these three were human. Anyway...thanks.
I am just reading one of my early Christmas presents, from Dan McClellan's intriguing book "YHWH's Divine Images, A Cognitive Approach," describing what it is that makes a deity a Deity. It has precious little to do with being a historical person first or not. It doesn't mean it is not an option, but it is not a necessary option in order for the reality of the Deity to be for any group who has and worships Deity. McClellan used to post here a few years back, and has really written a great book here.
I posted about his book some months back. But haven’t delved into myself yet. Thanks for the comments and for giving your impressions. Keep ‘em coming.
“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find another.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
Philo Sofee
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Re: Jesus is the reason baby

Post by Philo Sofee »

dastardly stem wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 3:31 pm
Philo Sofee wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 3:07 pm
I am just reading one of my early Christmas presents, from Dan McClellan's intriguing book "YHWH's Divine Images, A Cognitive Approach," describing what it is that makes a deity a Deity. It has precious little to do with being a historical person first or not. It doesn't mean it is not an option, but it is not a necessary option in order for the reality of the Deity to be for any group who has and worships Deity. McClellan used to post here a few years back, and has really written a great book here.
I posted about his book some months back. But haven’t delved into myself yet. Thanks for the comments and for giving your impressions. Keep ‘em coming.
I had two scholars tell me I really, REALLY need to get it, so I finally broke down and did so. So far, very interesting, though a little different than what I was expecting.
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Gabriel
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Re: Jesus is the reason baby

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dastardly stem wrote:
Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:37 pm
Gabriel wrote:
Sun Dec 11, 2022 8:58 am
DidJesusExist.jpg
Thanks for quoting the opening to his book. I don't get his "snark", to use huckelberry's word, trying to suggest all mythicists aren't qualified. Surely he knows that's not the case. As it turns out, the growing number of qualified scholars turning to mythicism is interesting. Have you read his book? What are the relevent parts you think may or may not argue well for historicity? I admit i was very disappointed in his effort.
Hey there Stem,

Sorry for the late reply. No, I haven't read Bart's book. What's your favorite book arguing for the ahistorical position? I'll put it next on my list of things to read so that I can round out my edgumication.

Sincerely,

Gabriel
dastardly stem
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Re: Jesus is the reason baby

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Gabriel wrote:
Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:21 pm
dastardly stem wrote:
Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:37 pm
Thanks for quoting the opening to his book. I don't get his "snark", to use huckelberry's word, trying to suggest all mythicists aren't qualified. Surely he knows that's not the case. As it turns out, the growing number of qualified scholars turning to mythicism is interesting. Have you read his book? What are the relevent parts you think may or may not argue well for historicity? I admit i was very disappointed in his effort.
Hey there Stem,

Sorry for the late reply. No, I haven't read Bart's book. What's your favorite book arguing for the ahistorical position? I'll put it next on my list of things to read so that I can round out my edgumication.

Sincerely,

Gabriel
The deep books get large and pricey. I'd recommend the two-part combo from Richard Carrier for any serious engagement: Proving History and On the Historicity Of Jesus. But to simplify and get a good rundown of the works read Jesus From Outer Space. The latter was written for a popular audience. It's short, like 2 hundredish pages and is easily consumable. The former two are heavy works.

My favorite because it was the latest I read is: Questioning the Historicity of Jesus By Raphael Lataster. It's expensive as you can see, and thus hard to get your hands on. But it too can be a bit dense. It's over 500 pages I think, or close to. I like it because he leaves it a bit more open, as I prefer. Carrier suggests similar with is analyses, but Lataster is more in the 50/50 range of Jesus' historicity. There are tons of problems claiming Jesus' historicity. He lays that out fairly well.
“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find another.”
― Carl Sagan, Cosmos
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Gabriel
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Re: Jesus is the reason baby

Post by Gabriel »

dastardly stem wrote:
Mon Jan 30, 2023 3:24 pm

The deep books get large and pricey. I'd recommend the two-part combo from Richard Carrier for any serious engagement: Proving History and On the Historicity Of Jesus. But to simplify and get a good rundown of the works read Jesus From Outer Space. The latter was written for a popular audience. It's short, like 2 hundredish pages and is easily consumable. The former two are heavy works.

My favorite because it was the latest I read is: Questioning the Historicity of Jesus By Raphael Lataster. It's expensive as you can see, and thus hard to get your hands on. But it too can be a bit dense. It's over 500 pages I think, or close to. I like it because he leaves it a bit more open, as I prefer. Carrier suggests similar with is analyses, but Lataster is more in the 50/50 range of Jesus' historicity. There are tons of problems claiming Jesus' historicity. He lays that out fairly well.

I'm currently in the middle of the three-part series Jesus of Nazareth by the recently deceased Pope Benedict XVI, Joseph Ratzinger. Jesus from Outer Space is next on my list. Thank you for the recommendation.
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