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Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 10:05 pm
by huckelberry
I wish him well. He has made good valuable contributions here in the past.
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:28 pm
by Shinzoa
Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:55 pm
Nomomo wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:37 pm
Just curious....... How can a brain that believes that the true history of the Americas came from a charlatan faker peeking at a magic rock in the bottom of his hat be magnificent? A sign of a magnificent brain that is not. Magnificent brains do not believe in such asinine ridiculously insane B.S..
I could be wrong, but I don't think Dan believes in the historicity of the Book of Mormon. If I recall correctly, Dan has a very nuanced view of the Book of Mormon as scripture.
Unless I am mistaken I don't think Dan has ever said he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:41 pm
by Moksha
Shinzoa wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:28 pm
Unless I am mistaken I don't think Dan has ever said he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon
If Dan can make determinations regarding the fact and fiction of biblical stories, why could he not do so for the Book of Mormon? Unless it has something to do with LDS employability.
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:49 pm
by Shinzoa
Moksha wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:41 pm
Shinzoa wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:28 pm
Unless I am mistaken I don't think Dan has ever said he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon.
If Dan can make determinations regarding the fact and fiction of biblical stories, why could he not do so for the Book of Mormon? Unless it has something to do with LDS employability.
Because unlike the Bible the Book of Mormon and it's historicity is a pretty fundamental part of the Mormon faith which he believes in so while he can accept the fact/fiction of Bible stories without it affecting his faith to do so with the Book of Mormon would very heavily disprove the truth claims of the Mormon faith.
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 2:13 pm
by Shulem
Shinzoa wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:49 pm
Because unlike the Bible the Book of Mormon and it's historicity is a pretty fundamental part of the Mormon faith which he believes in so while he can accept the fact/fiction of Bible stories without it affecting his faith to do so with the Book of Mormon would very heavily disprove the truth claims of the Mormon faith.
Agreed.
And, moreover, so also is the Book of Abraham:
Historical Predynastic Egypt vs. Book of Abraham False Narrative.
I wonder which checkbox Dan would mark as the one he believes is true with regard to dating the beginning of dynastic Egypt:
[ ] 2300 BC (Bible & Book of Abraham)
[ ] 3000 BC (Modern Egyptology)
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 3:08 pm
by dastardly stem
Shinzoa wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:49 pm
Moksha wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:41 pm
If Dan can make determinations regarding the fact and fiction of biblical stories, why could he not do so for the Book of Mormon? Unless it has something to do with LDS employability.
Because unlike the Bible the Book of Mormon and it's historicity is a pretty fundamental part of the Mormon faith which he believes in so while he can accept the fact/fiction of Bible stories without it affecting his faith to do so with the Book of Mormon would very heavily disprove the truth claims of the Mormon faith.
I'd say that's trying too hard to back someone into a corner. One can personally claim many stories lack historicity from the Book of Mormon and still think the religion is true in whatever sense they do. In fact, I'd think one could manage to think the whole of the Book of Mormon lacks historicity and still maintain the religion is true in a general sense. I know 'cause that was the path I intended some years back. It takes some serious effort to exhaust the level of nuance in one's faith, as they say, but it could be done.
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 12:27 am
by Everybody Wang Chung
Shinzoa wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:28 pm
Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:55 pm
I could be wrong, but I don't think Dan believes in the historicity of the Book of Mormon. If I recall correctly, Dan has a very nuanced view of the Book of Mormon as scripture.
Unless I am mistaken I don't think Dan has ever said he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon.
You are mistaken. Dan has stated several times he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon. He has a very nuanced view of the Book of Mormon as scripture.
Most recently (responding to the 11th comment):
Dan McClellan
1 month ago
I've talked many times before about how the data don't support the historicity of the Book of Mormon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RHgmL0kZBM
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 12:35 am
by Everybody Wang Chung
Shulem wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 2:13 pm
I wonder which checkbox Dan would mark as the one he believes is true with regard to dating the beginning of dynastic Egypt:
[ ] 2300 BC (Bible & Book of Abraham)
[ ] 3000 BC (Modern Egyptology)
I hope you don't make me CFR this too, but I'm pretty sure I've heard Dan state he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Abraham either.
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 1:01 am
by Shulem
Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑Tue Jan 31, 2023 12:35 am
Shulem wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 2:13 pm
I wonder which checkbox Dan would mark as the one he believes is true with regard to dating the beginning of dynastic Egypt:
[ ] 2300 BC (Bible & Book of Abraham)
[ ] 3000 BC (Modern Egyptology)
I hope you don't make me CFR this too, but I'm pretty sure I've heard Dan state he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Abraham either.
I can't imagine McClellan believes in the historicity of the Book of Abraham any more than Bokovoy. I doubt DCP does either for that matter. Peterson is on record for stating the Narmer Palette is firmly dated to 3000 BC and that is a total slam on the Book of Abraham.
Re: Dan McClellan exits church employment
Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2023 2:07 am
by malkie
Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑Tue Jan 31, 2023 12:27 am
Shinzoa wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:28 pm
Unless I am mistaken I don't think Dan has ever said he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon.
You are mistaken. Dan has stated several times he doesn't believe in the historicity of the Book of Mormon. He has a very nuanced view of the Book of Mormon as scripture.
Most recently (responding to the 11th comment):
Dan McClellan
1 month ago
I've talked many times before about how the data don't support the historicity of the Book of Mormon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RHgmL0kZBM
Of course, there are two schools of thought on this (I'm waiting for Kish to declare himself before I venture to do so
):
- those who - along with Mak - consider data to be plural
- those who consider data to be singular