God’s grace

[kairos]

As an evangelical grace is the unmerited,unearned favor of God given to us. DB lists lots of examples of grace but for us who believe in life after this life , look at Jesus words in John 3:26 “ for God so loved the world” That love is unearned and unmerited and it applies to all. Next the work of Jesus his substitutionary sacrifice of his death on the cross to pay the sin debt,past present and future of all
Is grace- we cannot save our selves . Jesus sacrifice is grace- unmerited , unearned favor of God offered to all.
Of course salvation and eternal life includes accepting this grace by believing and trusting in Christ which if authentic triggers in dwelling of the HS and a changed life giving God the glory of all we do in this life.

[kairos]

Sorry John 3:16!

[runewell]

I hope you don't mind a counter-question from one who does not think there is a God. I don't know if He/She/It does exist or not, but I see no evidence of a God who seems interested in what happens here on this planet, hence my question.

Why do you think a God who can create the universe is interested in a particular species that has only been around for a blink of an eye on this speck of dust we call earth?

Because He made us in his image (Gen. 1:27). Just like the trinity we have a body (Jesus), a soul (Father) and a spirit (Holy Ghost). God can choose to intervene in our lives as he sees fit, but he generally lets us live our lives at the same time. You can ask why God allows suffering, but man causes most of it on his own. In the end He plans to create a sin-free world for those who love him, but until that time there is little hope for this world in its current state.

[runewell]

I do not believe a god/being that would be powerful enough to make this universe would be so petty to demand unflinching obedience and worship, require blood for payment of something called sin and want to condemn thinking and sentient beings to a hell forever for not being able to get it all correct.

And do you believe that Jesus Christ rose from the dead? Accordingly to Wikipedia, "Virtually all modern scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus existed historically". According to the Bible he died and rose again - that is quite the miracle, to say nothing of everything else recorded in the gospels. Do you believe that happen? Does everything he said in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John ring true?

As a parent, there are times where you discipline your kids for disobedience. But none of us can truly even imagine what it would like to be God, and to have subjects that disobey you. We don't have a clue - do you think the lab rats have any clue what the scientists are like?

[MG 2.0]

We aren't that special to the universe, but we should be to ourselves. I think we devalue the uniqueness of our consciousness by making unsupported claims that we are debtors of unknowable beings who very clearly do not care to solve for evil and natural disaster.

Any suggestions as to how these “unknowable beings” ought to operate in the world in order to “solve for evil and natural disaster”?

Without going the ‘silver platter’ route or continually and consistently overruling the laws of nature? Plate techtonics and weather anomalies, etc.

Or zapping every evil character that shows up.

Regards,
MG

[huckelberry]

I do not believe a god/being that would be powerful enough to make this universe would be so petty to demand unflinching obedience and worship, require blood for payment of something called sin and want to condemn thinking and sentient beings to a hell forever for not being able to get it all correct.

And do you believe that Jesus Christ rose from the dead? Accordingly to Wikipedia, "Virtually all modern scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus existed historically". According to the Bible he died and rose again - that is quite the miracle, to say nothing of everything else recorded in the gospels. Do you believe that happen? Does everything he said in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John ring true?

As a parent, there are times where you discipline your kids for disobedience. But none of us can truly even imagine what it would like to be God, and to have subjects that disobey you. We don't have a clue - do you think the lab rats have any clue what the scientists are like?

runewell, It is true that virtually all scholars agree that Jesus existed historically.That is quite different than saying he rose from the dead which many scholars do not believe and some do. Why would you believe the Bible has the correct understanding of what happened? There is a lot of room for doubt.

I realize I do not really understand how God reacts to seeing humans do evil. I do not think it makes him get all fuzzy brained and lash out like people can do sometime. He could be letting it all return to dust in time. If not and there is a plan for continuation for human life I doubt it is a stupid plan. Extending indefinite injury to all people who do not understand and accept Jesus correctly strikes me as the sort of dumb plan some insecure and selfish human might come up with.

I realize that if in our actions we are participating in creating what we are it is possible to created ourselves into a condition incompatible with eternal life, at least with others.

[Jason Bourne]

I do not believe a god/being that would be powerful enough to make this universe would be so petty to demand unflinching obedience and worship, require blood for payment of something called sin and want to condemn thinking and sentient beings to a hell forever for not being able to get it all correct.

And do you believe that Jesus Christ rose from the dead? Accordingly to Wikipedia, "Virtually all modern scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus existed historically". According to the Bible he died and rose again - that is quite the miracle, to say nothing of everything else recorded in the gospels. Do you believe that happen? Does everything he said in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John ring true?

As a parent, there are times where you discipline your kids for disobedience. But none of us can truly even imagine what it would like to be God, and to have subjects that disobey you. We don't have a clue - do you think the lab rats have any clue what the scientists are like?

While I think it is clear Jesus was a historical figure I am skeptical that he rose from the dead. I recommend a book called How Jesus Became God by Bart Ehrman.

As for your last paragraph is seems off topic for this thread so I will pass on drilling into it.

[msnobody]

As an evangelical grace is the unmerited,unearned favor of God given to us. DB lists lots of examples of grace but for us who believe in life after this life , look at Jesus words in John 3:26 “ for God so loved the world” That love is unearned and unmerited and it applies to all. Next the work of Jesus his substitutionary sacrifice of his death on the cross to pay the sin debt,past present and future of all
Is grace- we cannot save our selves . Jesus sacrifice is grace- unmerited , unearned favor of God offered to all.
Of course salvation and eternal life includes accepting this grace by believing and trusting in Christ which if authentic triggers in dwelling of the HS and a changed life giving God the glory of all we do in this life.

Hey, Kairos. Nice to see you here. Haven’t seen you post for a while. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on God’s grace.

Someone at work’s email sig line reads something like this, God’s grace is not a license to sin, but a responsibility to live righteously.

[Alphus and Omegus]

We aren't that special to the universe, but we should be to ourselves. I think we devalue the uniqueness of our consciousness by making unsupported claims that we are debtors of unknowable beings who very clearly do not care to solve for evil and natural disaster.

Any suggestions as to how these “unknowable beings” ought to operate in the world in order to “solve for evil and natural disaster”?

Without going the ‘silver platter’ route or continually and consistently overruling the laws of nature? Plate techtonics and weather anomalies, etc.

Or zapping every evil character that shows up.

Regards,
MG

You're arguing against a personal god right there. Nicely done. I agree with everything you said.

It's hard to argue that there are graceful gods given all the terrible things that happen.

[MG 2.0]

Any suggestions as to how these “unknowable beings” ought to operate in the world in order to “solve for evil and natural disaster”?

Without going the ‘silver platter’ route or continually and consistently overruling the laws of nature? Plate techtonics and weather anomalies, etc.

Or zapping every evil character that shows up.

Regards,
MG

You're arguing against a personal god right there. Nicely done. I agree with everything you said.

It's hard to argue that there are graceful gods given all the terrible things that happen.

Define “personal god”. And then show your definition to be absolute. Please don’t skimp on your answer.

Regards,
MG