Church comments on SEC settlement

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MG 2.0
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

Post by MG 2.0 »

MG 2.0 wrote:
Wed Feb 22, 2023 1:52 am
Dr Moore wrote:
Wed Feb 22, 2023 1:41 am
Here’s the Deseret News article that goes into some depth:

https://www.deseret.com/u-s-world/2023/ ... -reporting

Critics will make some hay over this. Church members will read the article and move on.

Regards,
MG
From the article:

The church said it wanted to maintain the privacy of its holdings. Some church officials said previously that they wanted to avoid church members following church investments as a roadmap for personal investing because they might not be appropriate to their circumstances.
This ended up being a mistake. Good intentions with an unfortunate result. It’s fixed.

Regards,
MG
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Dr Moore
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

Post by Dr Moore »

MG 2.0 wrote:
Wed Feb 22, 2023 3:33 am
From the article:

The church said it wanted to maintain the privacy of its holdings. Some church officials said previously that they wanted to avoid church members following church investments as a roadmap for personal investing because they might not be appropriate to their circumstances.
This ended up being a mistake. Good intentions with an unfortunate result. It’s fixed.

Regards,
MG
This is an uninformed oversimplification. The church gave that as 1 of 3 reasons for hiding the assets. This 1 may be "fixed," but only with a stain of being lawbreakers forever, and then there are the other 2 which you conveniently choose to ignore, which are more problematic. All 3 are fear-based reasons and ultimately will break more shelves, even if not your own evidently titanium one (assuming you are capable of comprehending what comprises a shelf in the first place - I am not convinced).

The other two reasons given by church officials are/were:
(a) they worried members would stop paying tithing upon learning how much money the church had saved. That's going to be self-fulfilling. The only fix is to actually invest in humanitarian infrastructure and become like Jesus. Will not be easy but I hope they do it.
(b) they worried that the public would critique the church's use - or more correctly, non-use - of "sacred funds." This one also is self-fulfilling. Just use the funds like Jesus, rather than accumulate a top-100 stake in American capitalism, and the problem goes away. The critique they feared is warranted in every way.

Back to ignore for the inane troll.
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Everybody Wang Chung
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

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"I'm on paid sabbatical from BYU in exchange for my promise to use this time to finish two books."

Daniel C. Peterson, 2014
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Dr Moore
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

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One more thing about the weasel wording here. Notice the use of "regulations" instead of "law." In the question, but the answer mentions "the law."
Q: Did Ensign Peak fail to comply with SEC regulations?

A: We reached resolution with the SEC. We affirm our commitment to comply with the law, regret mistakes made, and now consider this matter closed.
The church is doing something incredibly sneaky and dishonest here. It wants to avoid admitting or even implying that it broke "the law." The question itself is written incorrectly in service of that end.

SEC form 13F is not merely an "SEC regulation." It is the law.

https://www.sec.gov/divisions/investment/13ffaq

What Is Form 13F and Who Files It?
Question 1
Q: What is Form 13F?

A: Form 13F is the reporting form filed by institutional investment managers pursuant to Section 13(f) of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934.

Congress passed Section 13(f) of the Securities Exchange Act in 1975 in order to increase the public availability of information regarding the securities holdings of institutional investors. See Section 13(f) of the Securities Exchange Act. Congress believed that this institutional disclosure program would increase investor confidence in the integrity of the United States securities markets.
Truthful version:
Q: Did Ensign Peak fail to follow the law?
A: Yes.
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Kishkumen
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

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You gotta love an in-house press release that lies in response to its own questions.
“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”~Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
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Everybody Wang Chung
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

Post by Everybody Wang Chung »

I wonder if the same language works with the Bishop, or at a church disciplinary council?

"I affirm my commitment to comply with the law, regret mistakes made and now consider this matter closed."
Last edited by Everybody Wang Chung on Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
"I'm on paid sabbatical from BYU in exchange for my promise to use this time to finish two books."

Daniel C. Peterson, 2014
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Dr Moore
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

Post by Dr Moore »

Kishkumen wrote:
Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:09 am
You gotta love an in-house press release that lies in response to its own questions.
Right? Ask the just-so worded question, answer it in just the right way. Winning! Just like FAIR!
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Kishkumen
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

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Everybody Wang Chung wrote:
Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:11 am
I wonder if the same language works with the Bishop, or at a church disciplinary council?

"I affirm my commitment to comply with the law, regret mistakes made and now consider this matter closed."
Well, yeah, of course it does. You can tell the bishop you pay a full tithing, and do they check your salary to see if you are telling the truth?

You can pass a temple recommend interview as long as you interpret the questions in your own way. Easy.

There have always been people who massage the truth, and many members certainly have and will.
“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”~Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
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Kishkumen
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

Post by Kishkumen »

Dr Moore wrote:
Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:11 am
Right? Ask the just-so worded question, answer it in just the right way. Winning! Just like FAIR!
They have feet of clay, and yet they really can’t give up playing God.
“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”~Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
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Dr. Sunstoned
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Re: Church comments on SEC settlement

Post by Dr. Sunstoned »

As I read through this latest news, I keep thing about past statements like this:

"There has been no attempt on the part of the church leaders to try to hide anything from anybody." —M. Russell Ballard
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