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Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:39 am
by Gadianton
Renowned scholar Doctor Scratch brought this to our attention on another thread but I think it deserves its own thread.
DCP wrote:I’ve had a number of people ask whether I could share a link to a video of my remarks on Easter Sunday. Not feeling entirely comfortable (or authorized) to treat a sacrament meeting talk that way, though, I sat down today with my friend Tom Pittman and recorded it. The talk is now available on YouTube as “Truly He has risen!” My delivery seems a bit lifeless to me, as I watch it now — sometimes a live audience is energizing — but I suppose it will serve the purpose.
Think about the implications of this. God the Father has created worlds without end. He's been through the plan of salvation more times than there are quarks in the entire universe. Yet, when he visited Joseph Smith in the grove, did he let out a lifeless, on the verge of snoring, "behold, this is my beloved son, hear him?"

No, it was as if it were the first time. It was a universe-shaking event of profundity.

But yet, here is DCP giving a talk on the resurrection for what, the hundredth time only? And he's bored. And the subject matter couldn't be more important, because this is the stuff he wants to beat critics over the head with. Sure, critics aren't going to accept any of the points he makes, he knows that, but what's in his power is to show them the majesty of the believer. He can show them how full of life the believer is, and the great celebratory affair the resurrection is.

What he shows us here is that he, like everyone else, is just suffering through the rote. Get it over with so he can go out to eat at Seasons 52 or Taco Bell.

Do you think God came back to the C after visiting Joseph Smith and said, "I suppose it will serve the purpose?"

Think of how terrible of an eternity that is going to be. Because Eternity is going to be real God-damned repetitive.

People will make comments now and again that DCP in brainwashed. Not so. He's just desperate. He's not brainwashed enough. If he were as convinced as people think, then he'd have been up there celebrating the majesty of the atonement and nearly fainting as he uttered the words to describe the greatest event in the universe. Not just in the earth, remember, because Jesus died for all the planets in this universe and is the most important of all God's planets, with the most righteous and the most wicked, and produced by a pure chain of God's who were the Christ's of their world.

It literally doesn't get better than this, and DCP is bored. What he hopes for deep down is that Gemli was right all along, and he doesn't have to bear this cross forever.

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:05 am
by Dr Moore
I remember one seminary class, back in the 1980s. Our teacher brought this very point up — the repetition of it all. And he asked the class for opinions. One hand went up: Heavenly Father probably entertains himself by creating the variety of animals. And then he gives man dominion over them and watches to see the unique responses. Our class talked about that idea for like half the early morning session. Teacher loved it. No, teacher didn’t give a better answer.

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:32 am
by malkie
The inimitable Peter Cook (the devil) and Dudley Moore, explaining what the pre-existence was like - and how the eternities will be:

https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkxvrn_8FYO4J ... k7UMmCZtQk

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 2:17 pm
by drumdude
I was wondering the other day: how Mormons reconcile the idea of an eternal universe with the redshift observation?

It seems like the Universe will keep expanding until it reaches heat death. And Mormon God, not being the creator but merely the organizer, would be helpless to prevent it.

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 2:42 pm
by Rivendale
I have always thought it was a bizarre plan. I like how John Larsen explains it.
If you are exalted you are just going to keep cranking out hundreds of billions of spirits. And they are going to suffer. And you are going to do it again and again. And you're going to do it again and again. After 100 billion generations why the exalted couple does not suffer I don't know. If this doesn't piss you off I don't know what is wrong with you.The people I love think this is the nature of reality. That we are just this endless factory producing endless suffering. It's offensive on the deepest level. I can't imagine believing this it is sick. ......If it's true we have one task. We have to hunt down what ever being started this and kill it.

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:04 pm
by Everybody Wang Chung
The band, The Talking Heads has a song called What A Day That Was. It’s about the first day of being in heaven and finally being able to do everything your heart desires. On the second day, after doing everything you wanted on the first day, you would now be faced with an eternity of boredom.

And on the first day, we had everything we could stand
Ooh who could've asked for more?
And on the second day, there was nothing else left to do
Ooh what a day that was.

https://youtu.be/_ZhmsrUOezI?t=51

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:32 pm
by Physics Guy
If a religion offers you a specific concept of eternal bliss that doesn't actually sound so blissful, at least not when extended eternally, then I agree that this has got to count against that religion. The general concept of eternal life, though, doesn't seem inherently silly to me.

Just last night, for some reason, I was thinking back over memories that I have from one particular place that I have visited often. I was amazed to realise how many memories I had from there. It was nice to remember them. They all seemed different and interesting. I was glad to have them.

My time on Earth hasn't been all that long, but I guess the end of middle age is in sight now, and so far I'm not getting bored. If there is an argument to say that eternal life wouldn't be worth having even if it were possible, I think that's just an argument from poverty of imagination.

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:17 pm
by Doctor CamNC4Me
Physics Guy wrote:
Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:32 pm
If a religion offers you a specific concept of eternal bliss that doesn't actually sound so blissful, at least not when extended eternally, then I agree that this has got to count against that religion. The general concept of eternal life, though, doesn't seem inherently silly to me.

Just last night, for some reason, I was thinking back over memories that I have from one particular place that I have visited often. I was amazed to realise how many memories I had from there. It was nice to remember them. They all seemed different and interesting. I was glad to have them.

My time on Earth hasn't been all that long, but I guess the end of middle age is in sight now, and so far I'm not getting bored. If there is an argument to say that eternal life wouldn't be worth having even if it were possible, I think that's just an argument from poverty of imagination.
You’re only in this thing for a few decades, friend. Get back to us in a trillion years. Heh.

- Doc

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 7:30 pm
by Gadianton
Physics Guy wrote:
Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:32 pm
If a religion offers you a specific concept of eternal bliss that doesn't actually sound so blissful, at least not when extended eternally, then I agree that this has got to count against that religion. The general concept of eternal life, though, doesn't seem inherently silly to me.

Just last night, for some reason, I was thinking back over memories that I have from one particular place that I have visited often. I was amazed to realise how many memories I had from there. It was nice to remember them. They all seemed different and interesting. I was glad to have them.

My time on Earth hasn't been all that long, but I guess the end of middle age is in sight now, and so far I'm not getting bored. If there is an argument to say that eternal life wouldn't be worth having even if it were possible, I think that's just an argument from poverty of imagination.
That's an interesting variation of the goldfish argument. They say a goldfish has a memory of 3 seconds. If that's true, then whether it lives a day or a year or for eternity it should be able to be happy for that time.

But then you sacrifice some of the pro's of eternal life, is it really eternal in the sense people mean it?

Re: Why Eternity is Pointless

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2023 7:34 pm
by malkie
Gadianton wrote:
Sat Apr 15, 2023 7:30 pm
Physics Guy wrote:
Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:32 pm
If a religion offers you a specific concept of eternal bliss that doesn't actually sound so blissful, at least not when extended eternally, then I agree that this has got to count against that religion. The general concept of eternal life, though, doesn't seem inherently silly to me.

Just last night, for some reason, I was thinking back over memories that I have from one particular place that I have visited often. I was amazed to realise how many memories I had from there. It was nice to remember them. They all seemed different and interesting. I was glad to have them.

My time on Earth hasn't been all that long, but I guess the end of middle age is in sight now, and so far I'm not getting bored. If there is an argument to say that eternal life wouldn't be worth having even if it were possible, I think that's just an argument from poverty of imagination.
That's an interesting variation of the goldfish argument. They say a goldfish has a memory of 3 seconds. If that's true, then whether it lives a day or a year or for eternity it should be able to be happy for that time.

But then you sacrifice some of the pro's of eternal life, is it really eternal in the sense people mean it?
Well, if we take a clue from the apologetic argument on eternal punishment, and say that eternal life is god's life, perhaps it's something else altogether.