Comments on Dan Vogel's new book "Charisma Under Pressure"

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
Post Reply
Philo Sofee
God
Posts: 5017
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 am

Comments on Dan Vogel's new book "Charisma Under Pressure"

Post by Philo Sofee »

https://youtu.be/AIz3PJ95L7w

I share a few ideas of Dan's I find quite profound and pertinent to our restudying Joseph Smith's Missouri and Ohio era histories. Very interesting book so far!
yellowstone123
High Priest
Posts: 386
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2023 1:55 am
Location: South East Idaho
Contact:

Re: Comments on Dan Vogel's new book "Charisma Under Pressure"

Post by yellowstone123 »

I agree it’s important to read biographies of people born in the USA between 1795 and 1810. Many led lives of honor and integrity. I always wondered if Joseph Smith Jr.walked passed Lincoln in Springfield Illinois in 1844 on the street.
What's faster than a .45 caliber bullet fired from a 1911 A1? The main spring of the gun below the barrel that seems to escape faster when you turn the barrel bushing with a special tool.
User avatar
Kishkumen
God
Posts: 6121
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:37 pm
Location: Cassius University

Re: Comments on Dan Vogel's new book "Charisma Under Pressure"

Post by Kishkumen »

Another great Vogel book is something to be excited about!
“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”~Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
Philo Sofee
God
Posts: 5017
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 am

Re: Comments on Dan Vogel's new book "Charisma Under Pressure"

Post by Philo Sofee »

Kishkumen wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 3:37 pm
Another great Vogel book is something to be excited about!
It is amazing. I am approx. 2/3rds the way through it and finding it so all encompassing excellent for context.
huckelberry
God
Posts: 2579
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:48 pm

Re: Comments on Dan Vogel's new book "Charisma Under Pressure"

Post by huckelberry »

Pious fraud is a theory Brody pointed out without making a complete commitment to the idea. There is room for Vogel to expand or review more evidence. I have usually been inclined to see Joseph as more understandable if there is some way or dimension in which he believed in what he was doing. It can be pointed out the the desire of others to believe in the project may have made it easier for Joseph to believe it.

When I read Mormonism and Magic world view I found myself wondering if it is possible Joseph believed he was in contact or understood some spiritual principal above the common imagery of Jesus and a God the father. If those are seen as images to lead people to a higher truth a person might feel that was a justification to employ some fiction to bring people along to this higher understanding. Well that and form a community of followers.

That separation between a higher understanding, gnosis, and lower common understanding could be the bridge used to cross between the space Joseph really believed and the fiction and theater he was using to get his movement started and built upon.
Post Reply