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Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2023 3:51 am
by TwoCumorahFraud
Re: Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2023 4:21 am
by drumdude
It’s a bad time to be a Mormon apologist. I imagine in the 60s and 70s they thought the church would win all of the arguments, find all of the evidence, and gather hundreds of millions into the fold.
If you showed them back then what apologetics would become today: Midnight Mormons, or NNL, or Boyland, it would bring them to tears.
Re: Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2023 5:19 am
by Gadianton
Back in the day, there was hope. Nibley was a huge student of and imitator of William F. Albright. He drops Albright's name constantly in his books.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_F._Albright
He was no slouch:
Throughout his life Albright was honored with awards, honorary doctorates, and medals, and was proclaimed "Yakir Yerushalayim" (Worthy Citizen of Jerusalem)—the first time that title had been awarded to a non-Jew.[27][28] He was elected a Fellow of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences in 1956.[29] After his death on September 19, 1971, his legacy continued through the many scholars inspired by his work, who specialized in the fields pioneered by Albright.
However:
From the 1930s until his death, he was the dean of biblical archaeologists and the acknowledged founder of the biblical archaeology movement. Coming from his background in German biblical criticism of the historicity of the biblical accounts, Albright, through his seminal work in archaeology (and his development of the standard pottery typology for Palestine and the Holy Land) concluded that the biblical accounts of Israelite history were, contrary to the dominant German biblical criticism of the day, largely accurate.
The formula is simple, what Albright did for the Bible, Nibley could do for the Book of Mormon.
[Albright's] central theses have all been overturned, partly by further advances in Biblical criticism, but mostly by the continuing archaeological research of younger Americans and Israelis to whom he himself gave encouragement and momentum... The irony is that, in the long run, it will have been the newer 'secular' archaeology that contributed the most to Biblical studies, not 'Biblical archaeology
Mopologetics had a brief window to ride the tailwinds of a movement that would never have accepted them but that they could point to and mimic and enjoy at least the pretense of legitimacy. The world moved on. There is no such thing as serious scholarship anymore that is "faithful" in the way they want it to be.
Re: Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2023 9:27 am
by Kishkumen
I wonder whether Dr. Gee is still pursuing the same goal of confirming the literal historicity of “ancient” scripture.
Re: Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2023 12:18 pm
by Rivendale
drumdude wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2023 4:21 am
It’s a bad time to be a Mormon apologist. I imagine in the 60s and 70s they thought the church would win all of the arguments, find all of the evidence, and gather hundreds of millions into the fold.
If you showed them back then what apologetics would become today: Midnight Mormons, or NNL, or Boyland, it would bring them to tears.
For example. The arrogance of the title " No, Ma'am, That's Not History". Or the relentless use of parallelism from John Sorenson. I think they thought they had critics on their heals and then came the digital revolution.
Re: Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:30 pm
by BeNotDeceived
Treasure Hunting (scrying, necromancing, divining rods)
Money digging
Magic/The Occult
Fraud
Obsession with ancient civilizations
Storytelling
Polygamy/adultery/financial shenanigans
Seer stones/rock in a hat
Book of Mormon is born
Running from the law
Vigilante/Outlaw
Incarcerations
Doctrine & Covenants is born
Traveling artifacts peddler (Michael Chandler)
Mummies
Egyptian Scrolls
Book of Abraham is born
Is there really a need to debate the legitimacy of what Smith created???

You have to be reliant on the 'church' for something (money, income, job, status, career, deep family involvement, etc.) in order to be aware of this stuff, yet, attempt to justify, explain or defend it with some embarrassing mental gymnastics.

Re: Built Upon a Foundation of LDS Apologists
Posted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:40 pm
by drumdude
BeNotDeceived wrote: ↑Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:30 pm
Treasure Hunting (scrying, necromancing, divining rods)
Money digging
Magic/The Occult
Fraud
Obsession with ancient civilizations
Storytelling
Polygamy/adultery/financial shenanigans
Seer stones/rock in a hat
Book of Mormon is born
Running from the law
Vigilante/Outlaw
Incarcerations
Doctrine & Covenants is born
Traveling artifacts peddler (Michael Chandler)
Mummies
Egyptian Scrolls
Book of Abraham is born
Is there really a need to debate the legitimacy of what Smith created???

You have to be reliant on the 'church' for something (money, income, job, status, career, deep family involvement, etc.) in order to be aware of this stuff, yet, attempt to justify, explain or defend it with some embarrassing mental gymnastics.
That’s why FAIRMormon splits these up and tries to isolate them one on one.
Once you see them in a list it hits different…