On being alone

[msnobody]

I see it in you guys all the time, but I respect that you may or may not see it in yourself/yourselves.

I disagree. in my opinion, your statement here is not showing respect for others any more than your first one was.

Which part is it that you find disrespectful?

1. Men are created in the image of God (imago dei); possess his communicable attributes?
2. That I see God’s communicable attributes in others?
3. That some may not see God’s communicable attributes in themselves?

[huckelberry]

Although polluted by sin, that is the imago dei in all of us.

I'm glad it works for you, and while it may be the image in you, it is NOT what "all of us" consider to be the image in all of us.

Marcus, perhaps you could explain a bit what you are hearing and being offended by here, I am missing it. On the surface I just see msnobody did not claim "all of us" consider anything. She commented on what she sees as the image of God in us.

[msnobody]

I'm glad it works for you, and while it may be the image in you, it is NOT what "all of us" consider to be the image in all of us.

Marcus, perhaps you could explain a bit what you are hearing and being offended by here, I am missing it. On the surface I just see msnobody did not claim "all of us" consider anything. She commented on what she sees as the image of God in us.

Maybe a better choice of words on my part could have been recognize versus respect.

[Marcus]

I'm glad it works for you, and while it may be the image in you, it is NOT what "all of us" consider to be the image in all of us.

Marcus, perhaps you could explain a bit what you are hearing and being offended by here, I am missing it. On the surface I just see msnobody did not claim "all of us" consider anything. She commented on what she sees as the image of God in us.

I'm not offended, I just disagree in that I do not believe there is "the imago dei" in me, because I don't believe a god exists. To me, using terms of one's belief and suggesting that those beliefs describe everyone's condition ("all of us") inaccurately describes and borders on usurping other's rights to describe themselves.

I would have no problem with and would probably be interested in hearing her describe herself as believing she has "the imago dei" in herself and how that might define or influence her. What she assumes about how something (which I consider imaginary) might affect me (it won't) is not part of that.

[huckelberry]

What do you suppose would cause Mr. Hancock (we have to assume based on the atheist chaplain’s prayer) to hope for oblivion upon death?

To many atheists, the idea of not existing after death is just as peaceful as not existing before birth.

You and I were in oblivion for billions of years. It caused none of us one bit of inconvenience or pain. It’s a natural thing to want the end to dovetail nicely into that beginning.

drumdude, for a first bit I reacted as you to the idea of an atheist minister approaching death. Then I reversed and thought it reasonable and appropriate if wished for. Thinking of death as oblivion, I do not wish to presume whether hope or resignation is in view here. People might have mixed feelings. Thinking abstractly, oblivion is not hard. Thinking of my parents, not so easy.

Do Not Go Gentle into That Good Night
By Dylan Thomas

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

[Chap]

To many atheists, the idea of not existing after death is just as peaceful as not existing before birth.

You and I were in oblivion for billions of years. It caused none of us one bit of inconvenience or pain. It’s a natural thing to want the end to dovetail nicely into that beginning.

Didn't Mark Twain say the same thing somewhere or other?

I think he put it roughly along the lines of "I am already well accustomed to being dead, since I was, in effect, dead right up to the time I was born, and I did not find it the least uncomfortable."

[drumdude]

To many atheists, the idea of not existing after death is just as peaceful as not existing before birth.

You and I were in oblivion for billions of years. It caused none of us one bit of inconvenience or pain. It’s a natural thing to want the end to dovetail nicely into that beginning.

Didn't Mark Twain say the same thing somewhere or other?

I think he put it roughly along the lines of "I am already well accustomed to being dead, since I was, in effect, dead right up to the time I was born, and I did not find it the least uncomfortable."

Yep. We already know what non-existence feels like.

Mormons will say that was just a sci-fi “memory wipe” but it’s a difference that is not testable. Unless Mormonism starts dipping into Scientology’s lane and starts trying to recover those memories.