It’s a Jubilee!

[Kishkumen]

Evidently the actual interview lasted three hours, but was edited down to 50 minutes. Much of the footage that was edited out was of Cardon's rants and grandstanding. Ward Radio are tools and fools!

It is really unfortunate. Kwaku is in some ways the best of the lot, but that is not saying too much. Oddly, there is a heck of a lot of talent there, but it is so poorly directed and ill-used that it trips all over itself. The results are the height of mediocrity. But maybe it is important to people who are in a certain shallow place. That is not to say it is unimportant in every way. But what is the long term cost of this approach? What do people really benefit from this? Does this result in Mormons stuck in mediocrity who never grow up? I wish them all well. I want them to be genuine grownups in every way and to live rich, rewarding lives. But I’m not seeing it. They may be experiencing that joy and satisfaction, but it does not come out in Ward Radio.

[Kishkumen]

And the ex-Mormons clearly won this one.

Which is not saying a lot. I think the very topic of Mormonism lost. I tune in for a moment and go find something a lot more satisfying to watch. It makes me feel like the whole topic is a waste of time. Maybe that’s where I am at personally, but that is how this made me feel.

[Bond]

Dehlin being in the same room as the morons is next level wild after all the crap they've said about him.

[yellowstone123]

Yawn...? Half my office in the 90s was gay. A girl I dated let me know that in the prior years she only dated women. My concern for gay youths who are seeking relationships is that they stay away from adults, and I told gay youth who I worked with that exact thing. I'm sure It must be difficult being attracted to the same sex and wanting to be with someone like a hetero couple at high school, but wait until you are 18.

[Kishkumen]

Dehlin being in the same room as the morons is next level wild after all the crap they've said about him.

That's how this space works, and, honestly, that is part of what I like about it. It is the case, however odd it may seem, that some of these folks can get along well enough to be in the same room, etc., despite the fact that they are on opposite ends in terms of opinions and sometimes say really unkind things about each other.

[Kishkumen]

Yawn...? Half my office in the 90s was gay. A girl I dated let me know that in the prior years she only dated women. My concern for gay youths who are seeking relationships is that they stay away from adults, and I told gay youth who I worked with that exact thing. I'm sure It must be difficult being attracted to the same sex and wanting to be with someone like a hetero couple at high school, but wait until you are 18.

Good advice to stay away from adults as a gay youth. Really, always good advice for every youth. Yes, I can't say I think very much of the LDS Church's approach to gender. Hopefully things are beginning to change . . . well, one always hopes and takes whatever crumb that looks hopeful and clings to it, unless one does not care anymore. What these people need is a revelation that recognizes the equality of all human beings. Someday there will be a prophet that was raised in such a way that they are open to it. Then the new Official Declaration will join the scriptures. Or a new Proclamation to replace the bad one.

[Morley]

I had to stop watching when, as you both mentioned, after around the 10 minute mark, Cardon fake-tears-up, says he has leukemia, and is going to die 20 years earlier than he would otherwise. He then suggests he would trade that lost 20 years for some gayness. That was so bad that it didn't even rise to the level of being wrong.

I am sure that his tears were genuine, but that he knew there was something wrong with the whole situation. I have felt that way before. You raise something that’s true, but there is something too personal about it in the situation to pull off and have it respected. It is a bit like casting your pearls before swine, but in this case I think the swine is always a part of the person who does the sharing. You know in your gut that you violated your self respect for a reason that was not quite right. Not sure I am saying this correctly.

I don’t think Cardon is a bad guy, but there is something off here. He seems to me to be lost, and that is a bit tragic albeit in a sadly predictable way.

I went back and watched this portion again and I think you hit on it. He may have realized, part way through, that his thought experiment, when expressed, wasn't quite as sharp as he had believed it was.

I agree with you that Cardon's probably not a bad fellow. I think that his impulse to condescend undermines his message.

[Boomer57]

Dehlin being in the same room as the morons is next level wild after all the crap they've said about him.

Dehlin is a lot classier than they will ever be.

[Kishkumen]

I went back and watched this portion again and I think you hit on it. He may have realized, part way through, that his thought experiment, when expressed, wasn't quite as sharp as he had believed it was.

I agree with you that Cardon's probably not a bad fellow. I think that his impulse to condescend undermines his message.

Yeah! The condescension. The difficult thing for people in that culture to understand is that outside of the Mormon in-group they have no authority. Still they have a tendency to mansplain stuff. When Cardon called the women on the panel "you girls" . . . Wow. I could see the women roll their eyes, and they were totally justified in doing so. So many times I watched "the priesthood" condescend to women, treat them like children. President Hinckley patting his wife on the head in a formal meeting setting. Bishops telling the women to go potty before the meeting starts. Where does it end?

All this reveals what they actually think. They don't want to believe that they act in an offensive way. They want others to bear the burden of feeling offended. But, come on, dudes, get with the times. Women are equal to men, my dudes. We don't treat them like children, or there will be consequences. There will be no going back to the bad old days there.

[Philo Sofee]

I went back and watched this portion again and I think you hit on it. He may have realized, part way through, that his thought experiment, when expressed, wasn't quite as sharp as he had believed it was.

I agree with you that Cardon's probably not a bad fellow. I think that his impulse to condescend undermines his message.

Yeah! The condescension. The difficult thing for people in that culture to understand is that outside of the Mormon in-group they have no authority. Still they have a tendency to mansplain stuff. When Cardon called the women on the panel "you girls" . . . Wow. I could see the women roll their eyes, and they were totally justified in doing so. So many times I watched "the priesthood" condescend to women, treat them like children. President Hinckley patting his wife on the head in a formal meeting setting. Bishops telling the women to go potty before the meeting starts. Where does it end?

All this reveals what they actually think. They don't want to believe that they act in an offensive way. They want others to bear the burden of feeling offended. But, come on, dudes, get with the times. Women are equal to men, my dudes. We don't treat them like children, or there will be consequences. There will be no going back to the bad old days there.

I suppose if the women really wanted to make the point stand out they could respond to that type of condescension with something like "put your little pee pee back in your pants dear, it's not a ruler as you may think it is."