Lds church is wrongly attacked for giving too little to charity....

[Marcus]

And why is that wrong? A certain blog proprietor explains.

The [lds] Church is a charity.

He then segues into a non sequitur of whether disaster aid, poverty relief, and food for the poor encompasses all of 'charity' (which is not the question).

...Engaging in those activities is not a requirement for being considered a charity under the laws of the United States...

Here's his entire nonsensical diatribe:

But I have a bit more to say about this:

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is often attacked by critics for giving too little to charity. But this attack is fundamentally misconceived. The Church is a charity. Donations to it are tax-deductible in the United States, for example, under the charitable-giving rules of the Internal Revenue Service — as are donations to the American Red Cross, the American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals. Not all recognized charities provide disaster aid or poverty relief or food for the poor. Engaging in those activities is not a requirement for being considered a charity under the laws of the United States. Many 501(c)3 tax-exempt charities (e.g., the Sierra Club, New York City’s Metropolitan Museum of Art, the Chicago Symphony Orchestra, the National Audubon Society, the Society for the Promotion of Japanese Animation, Salt Lake City’s Ballet West, the Interpreter Foundation, the Barbershop Harmony Society [formerly the Society for the Preservation and Encouragement of Barber Shop Quartet Singing in America, Inc. (SPEBSQSA)], the Natural History Museum of Los Angeles County, and the San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance) don’t provide disaster aid or poverty relief or food for the poor. And it would be rather strange to fault them because they don’t. They’re doing what they were founded and created to do. Complaining about that is rather like complaining that a television isn’t turning out healthy vegetables, or that a fork hasn’t cured cancer...
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... cause.html

[bolding added][please see the blog entry for his full commentary.]

So, the lds church is doing what it was created to do. Hoard money by funneling people's charitable contributions into their for-profit efforts.

You'll notice he also focuses on US law, bypassing the considerable issues the lds church currently has in other countries, related to noncompliance with their laws re charitable contributions.

I am curious what the general response of the lds church is on this question. This blog owner is admittedly an outlier, not only in the lds church leadership but also in the lds sanctioned apologetic world, so his opinion may be simply his own weird take, while not reflecting a concensus.

It would be interesting to hear from posters like Dr. Moore and Gadianton, among others, to see what the mainstream view is.

[Gadianton]

I agree the church shouldn't be attacked for not doing enough charity. It should be attacked for having hundreds of billions of dollars while putting the screws to well-meaning members. Riding the backs of members for every spare cent and then turning it over to charity isn't admirable either. Maybe it's slightly better than just letting aimless investments flourish.

[drumdude]

They would rather critics keep their attention on charitable giving and not look at the rampant nepotism. Being a family member or friend of Mormon royalty is incredibly lucrative. Those widows in Parowan keep them very comfortable.

[Moksha]

I see the LDS people as very charitable, which is a virtue.

[Gadianton]

hold on, I may have fell victim to Mopologist slight of hand. While some do feel the Church should do more charity, the argument is more often that like it's reported membership numbers, its the shameless self-trumpeting when in fact, when you dig into the details, it does as little as possible and stretches and breaks laws to get as much tax avoidance as possible from every penny given to the poor.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

I suppose a philosophical criticism of hoarding money in a church revolves around questions of moral integrity, ethical responsibility, and the alignment of actions with the core values and teachings of the faith.

But, what if the core values of said church is something other than what we’d normally expect from a church?

What if the core values of a church prioritizes solidifying dynastic power for a handful of families? Then the philosophical criticism would likely be more severe. In this case, hoarding money would be seen as a means to concentrate wealth and influence within a select group, rather than serving the broader community or adhering to ethical principles.

Obviously most Mormons, and certainly the Mopologists, would disagree reciting the mission of the Mormon religion as a counter to criticism, but if that were the case, then why feel obliged to be charitable at all? Is it charity or perception management?

Wouldn’t an ethicist, though, view hoarding such a significant sum without clear justification or oversight as a failure of stewardship? Sure it’s amazing the Mormons can turn a nickel into a dime, but the sheer opaqueness of it all erodes trust and with the community, particularly if congregants expect their donations to be used for charitable purposes.

I dunno. It’s their business, BUT this is turning into a game of Monopoly with those kinds of resources.

- Doc

[Doctor Scratch]

There is a lot that's funny about DCP's post. He either doesn't quite know what he's talking about, or he's deliberately muddying the waters. The LDS Church is not a "charity." Charities *do* fall under the 501(c)(3) rules of the IRS, but so do "Churches and Religious Organizations." In fact, "Political Organizations" and "Private Foundations"--such as the Interpreter Foundation--also fit the bill. Did you know that private individuals can personally donate a rather sizable chunk of their income to their own Private Foundations and then get a nice tax break as a result? What do you want to bet that DCP is taking advantage of this?

Then again, it may be that he is clueless about tax law. When he was pressed on the fact that IRS documents proved that he had been paid over $20,000 to serve as "Chair of FARMS," one of the explanations he gave was that he "didn't remember" anything about getting paid that amount, and that he was a "complete neanderthal" when it comes to understanding the intricacies of US tax law.

In any case: I found it very amusing that he put the LDS Church in the same basic category as the Barbershop Harmony Society and ASPCA. You tell me: does the LDS Church have more in common with those two organizations, or with the Red Cross?

[Markk]

I agree the church shouldn't be attacked for not doing enough charity. It should be attacked for having hundreds of billions of dollars while putting the screws to well-meaning members. Riding the backs of members for every spare cent and then turning it over to charity isn't admirable either. Maybe it's slightly better than just letting aimless investments flourish.

First and foremost, with zero doubt in my mind, "the church" should be "attacked" for hanging everyone out to dry and making the "stock holders" and "critics" just guess and debate this crap. I have been on forums like this, and discussing and debating this crap for over 30 years and I am still guessing on their purpose and intent, DCP is guessing, Nelson is guessing. I have come to the conclusion, based on my construction management life, there are times when managing a project that one is either forced, because of circumstances beyond ones control, to be either proactive or reactionary. The LDS church these days are 1000% reactionary, all hope of being proactive and getting out ahead are long gone. They are just sitting in their chairs waiting for the next wave. Their only proactive action is to build more temples.

It is getting to the point I almost feel sorry for these guys. But I don't.

[I Have Questions]

The only reason the Church gives the amounts it gives now is because of bad PR in the past, brought on by giving relatively nothing.

Elder Dallin H. Oaks of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles said the LDS Church spends approximately $40 million on humanitarian and welfare efforts per year, and has done so for more than 30 years.

Deseret News said, “That would account for approximately $1.2 billion on welfare and humanitarian efforts over the past 30 years.”

https://www.ldsdaily.com/church-lds/lds ... e_vignette

That’s from 2016. At a point when the Church was already eye-wateringly wealthy, but successfully hiding that fact. The Church cannot be trusted to do the right thing when they think nobody is looking. They’ve had to be publicly shamed into giving the current amounts to charities. And of course, none of that comes from the hoard. It’s been well documented that the hoarded cash has only been spent twice - once on City Creek, and once to bail out the Church’s Insurance company.

[drumdude]

Tangentially related:




I think the church opening up its finances would be nearly universally celebrated.