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Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 5:45 pm
by drumdude
Twice a year during general conference Mormons are told endless stories about Heavenly Father performing little miracles for them. Russel Nelson’s amazing survival from the grips of a minor mechanical issue with a plane, his foresight in cancelling a couple business trips before COVID- Mormons are primed to look for these miracles in their every day lives.

Then along comes the Trump incident. His life spared with the margin of less than an inch. If there was ever anything that could be called divine providence, it was this.

So why did Heavenly Father reach down and save Trump?

Daniel has been pondering the religious aspect of this event:
“DCP” wrote: As everyone knows, former President Donald J. Trump was nearly assassinated late last week, grazed by a bullet that hit his right ear and bloodied the right side of his face. (One man in the audience was killed, and two others were seriously wounded.) In response to Mr. Trump’s very visible injury, somebody has posted the following online:
In the Bible, the concept of blood on the right ear (Leviticus 8:22-24 and 14:28) serves as a visible mark of consecration, signifying that the person is dedicated to God’s service and has been set apart for a specific purpose. This act represents a physical and spiritual transformation, preparing the individual for their sacred role. Here’s a breakdown of the significance:

* Right ear: The right ear represents hearing and obedience. In ancient times, the right ear was considered the most important ear, as it was the ear that heard the words of God.

* Blood: Blood represents life, sacrifice, and atonement. In this context, the blood is a symbol of purification and consecration. * Consecration: Consecration means to set something or someone apart for a specific purpose, making it holy and dedicated to God. In this case, the blood on the right ear signifies that the person is being set apart for a sacred task or role.

* Priestly consecration: In Leviticus 8, the blood is applied to the right ear of Aaron and his sons, consecrating them as priests. This act sets them apart as mediators between God and the people.

* Purification: In Leviticus 14, the blood is applied to the right ear of the person being cleansed, symbolizing their purification and restoration to the community
To which my response is No. Please. Please, let’s not do this. Let’s not go there. The American Founders never envisioned the government of the United States as a substitute for the Church, and they would, I’m confident, be horrified at any thought of the “chief magistrate” of the Executive Branch being venerated as a priest or messiah or prophet, a mediator of the divine. Politics, while highly important, should be kept in a subordinate place. Patriotism should remain safely distant from idolatry, and there should be no personality cults in American political life. The Führerprinzip has no legitimate role in our constitutional government.
I couldn’t help but laugh at Dan’s response. Interpreter publishes hundreds of articles just like this. Linking disparate things together to try and prove a point. Suddenly he’s squeamish about appealing to parallel-o-mania? :roll:

One commenter on the blog points out that it’s hard to believe God wasn’t at work:
“SeN commenter” wrote:I actually probably do believe Trump was spared by God, though I don't presume to speculate too much on the reasons why he was, or why the father who bravely protected his family was not. God's thoughts are higher than our thoughts, especially our partisan political thoughts. Trump himself clearly sees it as an act of God as well though, as almost anyone who survives an attack on their life probably would.

The question is whether that realization will cause self-reflection and lead him to change and treat his life as if he owes it to God, or if he will interpret it as a sign of some kind of divine approval or mandate from God . He's expressed before the idea that "God is on my side," and I think he even said it in his RNC speech. In a sense God is on everyone's side, because He wills our ultimate good, but as Jonah Goldberg pointed out this week, there's also a dangerously prideful interpretation of that statement, which is something like, "I'm so awesome, even God must be a fan," which is why I think Lincoln's formulation of the question is much better than Trump's:

“Sir, my concern is not whether God is on our side, my greatest concern is to be on God’s side, for God is always right.”
This is a major problem with appealing to miracles. If we are going to use the miraculous as a sign to guide us on who God has chosen for us to follow, then it’s easy for Trump to tap into this reservoir of credulity.

The Mormon church couldn’t buy a miracle this incredible, they’re stuck making mountains out of molehills. And you can’t help but wonder what the members are thinking when they compare the two. Maybe Trump is God’s living prophet on the earth…

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 6:01 pm
by tapirrider
Playing devil's advocate, perhaps God didn't protect him at all, maybe the dragon did.

Revelations 13:
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 7:16 pm
by huckelberry
“DCP” wrote:To which my response is No. Please. Please, let’s not do this. Let’s not go there. The American Founders never envisioned the government of the United States as a substitute for the Church, and they would, I’m confident, be horrified at any thought of the “chief magistrate” of the Executive Branch being venerated as a priest or messiah or prophet, a mediator of the divine. Politics, while highly important, should be kept in a subordinate place. Patriotism should remain safely distant from idolatry, and there should be no personality cults in American political life. The Führerprinzip has no legitimate role in our constitutional government.
I thought Daniel Peterson was clear and on target. I am glad he said it though I might also find it a bit obvious.

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 10:48 pm
by Everybody Wang Chung
One Mormon who is not unsure how to frame Trump's divine protection is artist Jon McNaughton.

Here is Jon's latest Trump painting:


Image

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 11:00 pm
by drumdude
Everybody Wang Chung wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2024 10:48 pm
On Mormon who is not unsure how to frame Trump's divine protection is artist Jon McNaughton.

Here is Jon's latest Trump painting:


Image

Good Lord!

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 11:44 pm
by Gadianton
Imagine if a certain father and son team are Trump supporters, and decide to investigate the probability of that bullet missing Trump.

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 2:56 am
by Moksha
Some Mormons and Evangelicals would crucify Jesus if he questioned Donald Trump's divinity.

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 9:34 am
by bill4long
drumdude wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2024 5:45 pm
The Mormon church couldn’t buy a miracle this incredible, they’re stuck making mountains out of molehills. And you can’t help but wonder what the members are thinking when they compare the two. Maybe Trump is God’s living prophet on the earth…
What I find fascinating is that Trump wasn't even wearing Mormon Magic Underwear®

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 9:38 am
by bill4long
tapirrider wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2024 6:01 pm
Playing devil's advocate, perhaps God didn't protect him at all, maybe the dragon did.

Revelations 13:
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Whatever may have intervened to spare Trump, "all the world" worshipping Satan the Dragon doesn't seem plausible.

Re: Mormons unsure how to frame Trump’s divine protection

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 9:39 am
by bill4long
Moksha wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2024 2:56 am
Some Mormons and Evangelicals would crucify Jesus if he questioned Donald Trump's divinity.
Okay, this is funny