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CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 2:53 pm
by Kishkumen
https://youtu.be/_fj7rSWGyF0?si=Q2BpfWs3jqNCT04m
The LDS Church is sensitive about its name. For many years, people casually called it the Mormon Church. The Church insists on being called The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Ex-Mormons sometimes call it "The Corporation" or "The Corporation of the President." What's all the fuss about?
A little musing on the oddness of the name of the LDS Church being a controversial issue in comparison with other churches. How our naming of the LDS Church reflects our feelings about it.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 3:22 pm
by drumdude
Hopefully once Russell Nelson vacates his position, the church will return to a place of sanity on this trivial issue.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 3:24 pm
by Kishkumen
drumdude wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 3:22 pm
Hopefully once Russell Nelson vacates his position, the church will return to a place of sanity on this trivial issue.
I agree. It is one of the silliest decisions from the First Presidency that I have ever seen.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 4:00 pm
by Moksha
Kishkumen wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 3:24 pm
drumdude wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 3:22 pm
Hopefully once Russell Nelson vacates his position, the church will return to a place of sanity on this trivial issue.
I agree. It is one of the silliest decisions from the First Presidency that I have ever seen.
So Satan will return the word Mormon to its former status?
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 4:19 pm
by Kishkumen
Moksha wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 4:00 pm
So Satan will return the word Mormon to its former status?
Satan never had anything to do with this decision.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 5:41 pm
by Moksha
Kishkumen wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 4:19 pm
Moksha wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 4:00 pm
So Satan will return the word Mormon to its former status?
Satan never had anything to do with this decision.
Next, you will tell me the Book of Mormon is all made up.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 6:00 pm
by Gadianton
As you point out, it's actually called the corporation of the president of... the president and the corporation come way before Jesus.
The obsession of Rusty is nothing more than trademark and marketing competition. "Christianity" is a broad term. It covers a lot of people and a lot of sub organizations that are themselves huge. It's the cornerstone of western civilization as we know it.
Therefore, it's not surprising that Evangelicals have gone nuts drawing lines of division between Christians and cults. It's a way to coopt this foundational word for themselves, while denying people who disagree with their theology coverage. Not that any bright person would be tricked outright, but in the same way marketing gimmicks have their place, there is merit to the strategy. If I'm a college student raised in the West, and I'm thinking maybe I should look into joining a church, it would probably be a church within the scope of Christianity. Then if I hear classmates refer to themselves constantly as Christian, it may spark bias in my investigation that these folks (Pentecostals) will be the neutral starting point for learning about Christianity.
Rusty wants the same dirty psychology on his side. I didn't catch the Rev mentioning that guidelines also allow "The Church of Jesus Christ" for short. There are thousands of churches who believe they are members of Christ's Church. But if Rusty can convince the world to call Mormons "The Church of Jesus Christ," it's akin to forcing the world to say it's the only true church. Not that a bright person will be tricked, but the branding might work to bias a seeker into associating a church that calls itself "the Church of Jesus Christ" with a solid neutral starting point for finding a Christian church.
Christians were also first called Christians by outsiders, and people had been following Jesus long before that. You could call yourselves Jesusites, or Jesusians, or followers of Jesus, which all work to show that you follow Jesus. We used to get called Mormons, but almost as often, we'd be called "Latter-Day Saints". "Oh! I get it now, you guys are the Latter-Days!" Happened all the time. These labels aren't insults, but a way to identify your unique denomination from the other unique denominations, whereas saying you're a member of Christ's Church or a Christian tells people nothing.
Christians may not want to admit their denomination outright to a seeker because it's not about the Church, but the personal relationship with Jesus. But once you get into it, the denomination will become very important, because if I talk a big Jesus game to a Christian, my lingo is getting judged for its consistency within their culture. I might pass, but at a certain point, if I never reveal my denomination, there will be a deep curiosity and reservation until it's known whether the denomination I attend is a Bible-believing church.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 6:20 pm
by Doctor CamNC4Me
Cult, 100%. What part of your life didn’t the church try to control? Sex, food, underwear, dating, reproduction, financials, relationships, speech, mannerism, personal appearance, and so forth. What part about their history haven’t they lied about to maintain this control over others?
- Doc
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 11:25 pm
by Kishkumen
Moksha wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 5:41 pm
Next, you will tell me the Book of Mormon is all made up.
Re: CWK: What do YOU call the LDS Church?
Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2024 11:27 pm
by Kishkumen
Gadianton wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2024 6:00 pm
As you point out, it's actually called the corporation of the president of... the president and the corporation come way before Jesus.
The obsession of Rusty is nothing more than trademark and marketing competition. "Christianity" is a broad term. It covers a lot of people and a lot of sub organizations that are themselves huge. It's the cornerstone of western civilization as we know it.
Therefore, it's not surprising that Evangelicals have gone nuts drawing lines of division between Christians and cults. It's a way to coopt this foundational word for themselves, while denying people who disagree with their theology coverage. Not that any bright person would be tricked outright, but in the same way marketing gimmicks have their place, there is merit to the strategy. If I'm a college student raised in the West, and I'm thinking maybe I should look into joining a church, it would probably be a church within the scope of Christianity. Then if I hear classmates refer to themselves constantly as Christian, it may spark bias in my investigation that these folks (Pentecostals) will be the neutral starting point for learning about Christianity.
Rusty wants the same dirty psychology on his side. I didn't catch the Rev mentioning that guidelines also allow "The Church of Jesus Christ" for short. There are thousands of churches who believe they are members of Christ's Church. But if Rusty can convince the world to call Mormons "The Church of Jesus Christ," it's akin to forcing the world to say it's the only true church. Not that a bright person will be tricked, but the branding might work to bias a seeker into associating a church that calls itself "the Church of Jesus Christ" with a solid neutral starting point for finding a Christian church.
Christians were also first called Christians by outsiders, and people had been following Jesus long before that. You could call yourselves Jesusites, or Jesusians, or followers of Jesus, which all work to show that you follow Jesus. We used to get called Mormons, but almost as often, we'd be called "Latter-Day Saints". "Oh! I get it now, you guys are the Latter-Days!" Happened all the time. These labels aren't insults, but a way to identify your unique denomination from the other unique denominations, whereas saying you're a member of Christ's Church or a Christian tells people nothing.
Christians may not want to admit their denomination outright to a seeker because it's not about the Church, but the personal relationship with Jesus. But once you get into it, the denomination will become very important, because if I talk a big Jesus game to a Christian, my lingo is getting judged for its consistency within their culture. I might pass, but at a certain point, if I never reveal my denomination, there will be a deep curiosity and reservation until it's known whether the denomination I attend is a Bible-believing church.
Do you think President Nelson ever truly believed that he would get journalists to call the LDS Church "The Church of Jesus Christ"? It just seems so unlikely. By the way, good catch with that. I had forgotten it. But, then, it is just too bonkers.