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The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 5:50 pm
by Everybody Wang Chung
*Minor Spoiler*
Most Mormons were unfamiliar with Joseph Smith using his seer stone in a hat to translate the Book of Mormon, until South Park devoted an entire episode about the seer stones/translation of the Book of Mormon. The Church was forced to finally publicly address this issue due to the South Park episode.
Well, in the film Heretic, Hugh Grant discusses several problematic issues in Church history. One of these issues Hugh Grant discusses is the Fanny Alger affair and all the controversy that isn't known to most Mormons. It was a little strange to hear Hugh Grant discuss Fanny Alger. I think Heretic will finally force the Church to publicly address the issue.
I guarantee there are tens of thousands (if not more) of Mormons who watched Heretic this weekend and were busy Googling "Fanny Alger."
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 6:25 pm
by Marcus
And of course, scripturecentral.org 'fact-checks' the movie.
...The film inaccurately implies that Joseph Smith had an affair with a 16 year-old named Fanny Alger, and that Smith’s revelation about plural marriage was merely a convenient way to get free sex. First, the current best historical evidence suggests Fanny was 18 at the time, not 16.3 Second, whether or not Fanny and Joseph had sex, or were caught being physically intimate in some way, is not clear from the historical record, even though they clearly had some sort of relationship. Third, and most importantly, the historical evidence strongly indicates that Fanny was married to Joseph Smith as a plural wife. This is, of course, a controversial matter and no one can historically prove or disprove whether Smith’s practice of plural marriage was directed by God. But the film—or, at the very least, Mr. Reed as a character—either overclaims or misstates some of the crucial details...
https://scripturecentral.org/blog/fact- ... bcc7b4b-en
The crucial details, for virtually everyone watching the movie, will be that Smith, aged at least 29, illegally engaged in bigamy and used the excuse of 'god told me to,' to have an affair with a teenager who was a servant in his home, behind his wife's back.
Oliver Cowdery, one of the Book of Mormon witnesses, described the event as the "...dirty, nasty, filthy scrape of his and Fanny Alger's..."
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 6:51 pm
by Dr Exiled
3rd and most importantly was that Joseph Smith was married to Ms. Alger?
Sorry, scripturecentral.org, but that doesn't cut it for the masses out there (potential converts) and shouldn't move the needle for the member that views marriage between a man and women like the family proclamation says.
Looks like sex wins the motivation sweepstakes yet again.
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 7:06 pm
by drumdude
Likely more Mormons are googling Fanny Alger than have watched "Six Days in August." What a nasty, dirty little affair.
https://trends.google.com/trends/explor ... lger&hl=en
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 7:12 pm
by Rivendale
Many many believers are losing their minds over this movie because of its portrayal of violence towards women (and it is another movie showing the warts of Mormonism). This despite their tacit agreement with the theology that has levels of rewards or decreasing amounts of happiness including an outer darkness. For all of humanity? And for eternity. As Christopher Hitchens said, "At least you can die to escape North Korea". In Mormon heaven, there are swaths of eternal torture that don't cause a single raised eyebrow.
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 7:18 pm
by drumdude
The movie begins with a scene where two young, seemingly naïve, sister missionaries are sitting on a park bench discussing huge penises. I think the pissing off Mormons part was very intentional.
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 7:31 pm
by yellowstone123
Everybody Wang Chung wrote: ↑Mon Nov 11, 2024 5:50 pm
*Minor Spoiler*
Most Mormons were unfamiliar with Joseph Smith using his seer stone in a hat to translate the Book of Mormon, until South Park devoted an entire episode about the seer stones/translation of the Book of Mormon. The Church was forced to finally publicly address this issue due to the South Park episode.
Well, in the film Heretic, Hugh Grant discusses several problematic issues in Church history. One of these issues Hugh Grant discusses is the Fanny Alger affair and all the controversy that isn't known to most Mormons. It was a little strange to hear Hugh Grant discuss Fanny Alger. I think Heretic will finally force the Church to publicly address the issue.
I guarantee there are tens of thousands (if not more) of Mormons who watched Heretic this weekend and were busy Googling "Fanny Alger."
My question is - would it be covered by the ever-lasting-covenant or was it an extra-legal-marriage, meaning one the that was not regulated or sanctioned by law? I posted a while back that it was an extra-legal-marriage.
Now if those legally married found times difficult just imagine those who were not legally married. Here are some thoughts on marriage from Anne Brown Adams, daughter of abolitionist John Brown:
https://www.gilderlehrman.org/history-r ... irca-1880s
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 7:56 pm
by Marcus
Dr Exiled wrote: ↑Mon Nov 11, 2024 6:51 pm
3rd and most importantly was that Joseph Smith was married to Ms. Alger?
Sorry, scripturecentral.org, but that doesn't cut it for the masses out there (potential converts) and shouldn't move the needle for the member that views marriage between a man and women like the family proclamation says.
Looks like sex wins the motivation sweepstakes yet again.
Seriously, right? That is unbelievably tone deaf. Imagine someone unfamiliar with Mormons reading that a 30 year old man slept with the teenager working in his home, behind his wife's back. BUT, Mormons explain it by saying he 'married' her, so it's sort of okay. Or at least god told him so.
Because illegally marrying a second wife excuses sex with a teenager who works for you, in your own home, behind your wife's back.
Sorry Mormons, the average moviegoer won't see that as the excuse you think it is.
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:22 pm
by Dr Moore
I saw Heretic yesterday (Sunday 11/10).
Think I will start a spoiler thread to discuss. I loved it.
Re: The Film Heretic Discusses The Fanny Alger Affair
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:30 pm
by Rivendale
Dr Moore wrote: ↑Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:22 pm
I saw Heretic yesterday (Sunday 11/10).
Think I will start a spoiler thread to discuss. I loved it.
I thought it was excellent.