Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
I signed up for (and then canceled) a trial subscription at Newspapers.com. It had at least some issues of the two Millard County papers at the time. I did some pretty wide searches in Utah papers starting from 1/1/1960 to 12/31/1989. No joy.
Now, I don't know whether the collections of the relevant papers at that site are complete for the relevant time period. So the most I can say is I looked and could not verify.
I couldn't find FAA records for emergency landings in 1976.
Now, I don't know whether the collections of the relevant papers at that site are complete for the relevant time period. So the most I can say is I looked and could not verify.
I couldn't find FAA records for emergency landings in 1976.
he/him
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.
Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.
Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
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Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
Can someone make sense of the NTSB's website? I'm on my phone and it's too wonky for me to try to use their search engine right now.
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Hugh Nibley claimed he bumped into Adolf Hitler, Albert Einstein, Winston Churchill, Gertrude Stein, and the Grand Duke Vladimir Romanoff. Dishonesty is baked into Mormonism.
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Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
The pilot of that miraculous flight
Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
Hi Res and Lem,
Like Lem, I assumed this story to be about a 6 to 10 place private twin aircraft with piston engines (Piper Navajo or Cessna 402, etc.), flying from SLC to St. George.
Unless this took place long ago, small commuter planes would have had turboprop engines and a co-pilot. There would have likely been fire extinguishers in the engine nacelles, even though turboprops very seldom experience engine fires.
The probability of the events described (e.g., spinning the aircraft as a result of an engine out event) taking place in a professionally piloted and lightly loaded turboprop commuter would be close to zero. Six passengers aboard a 15 passenger Beach 99, or similar, would be such a light load that an engine out could be easily handled by a crew of two in the cockpit. If a plane is mechanically able to sustain controlled flight, under power or gliding, it's likely that a competent aircrew can bring everyone down safely.
Fatal commercial passenger aircraft accident reports are available online, including on Wikipedia. In a cursory inspection looking for turboprop commuter aircraft accidents as a consequence of one engine out, I found none.
Engine out problems? Consider Captain Sully Sullenberger, who ditched an Airbus safely in the Hudson River with both engines out and no serious injuries. This feat was preceded by an aircrew in the 1950s. These guys landed a passenger prop plane in the ocean near Hawaii when two of its four piston engines failed. (Nothing close to Sullenberger's feat, but big news at the time.) Again, no casualties.
Last edited by DrW on Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
I ran a search here: https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/index.aspxDoctor CamNC4Me wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 5:01 pmCan someone make sense of the NTSB's website? I'm on my phone and it's too wonky for me to try to use their search engine right now.
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Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
Found one incident for that date
https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 1778&key=0
It's the only incident for that date in Utah. There is only one other incident for the month of November 1976 in Utah. Nelson's "Doors Of Death" story appears to be a Dunnism.
https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 1778&key=0
It's the only incident for that date in Utah. There is only one other incident for the month of November 1976 in Utah. Nelson's "Doors Of Death" story appears to be a Dunnism.
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Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
Hrm.IHAQ wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:13 pmFound one incident for that date
https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 1778&key=0
It's the only incident for that date in Utah. There is only one other incident for the month of November 1976 in Utah. Nelson's "Doors Of Death" story appears to be a Dunnism.
"The Cessna 210 Centurion is a six-seat, high-performance, retractable-gear, single-engine, high-wing general aviation aircraft. First flown in January 1957, it was produced by Cessna until 1986." - Wikipedia
So, a six-seater, but single engine. So close ...
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Hugh Nibley claimed he bumped into Adolf Hitler, Albert Einstein, Winston Churchill, Gertrude Stein, and the Grand Duke Vladimir Romanoff. Dishonesty is baked into Mormonism.
Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
Yeah, found that one. But it was also carried in a local paper. It identified all four passengers -- none of them were Nelson.IHAQ wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:13 pmFound one incident for that date
https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 1778&key=0
Looks like Sheri Dew might have been too eager to give details. I don't see Nelson giving dates.
The problem is, as always, the way memory works. If this happened in 1976 and the first version we have is from 2003, Nelson almost certainly misremembers details important to finding confirmation of the incident. That's especially true if he's been telling the story for decades. The brain changes the memory every time it is recalled. So, it's very possible that the "sting" of the story (he thought he was going to die but was at peace) actually happened, but details are misremembered. People's recollection of dramatic events changes over time, especially if they think or talk about them frequently. That's just how brains work.
he/him
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.
Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.
Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
in my opinion, the date is the least reliable information we have. Nelson himself doesn't mention it. It's second-hand from Sheri Dew.IHAQ wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:13 pmFound one incident for that date
https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 1778&key=0
It's the only incident for that date in Utah. There is only one other incident for the month of November 1976 in Utah. Nelson's "Doors Of Death" story appears to be a Dunnism.
he/him
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.
Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
When I go to sea, don’t fear for me. Fear for the storm.
Jessica Best, Fear for the Storm. From The Strange Case of the Starship Iris.
Re: Fact Checking Nelson's "Doors Of Death" light aircraft near death experience
I think his first telling of the story was in 1992Res Ipsa wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:22 pmYeah, found that one. But it was also carried in a local paper. It identified all four passengers -- none of them were Nelson.IHAQ wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:13 pmFound one incident for that date
https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 1778&key=0
Looks like Sheri Dew might have been too eager to give details. I don't see Nelson giving dates.
The problem is, as always, the way memory works. If this happened in 1976 and the first version we have is from 2003, Nelson almost certainly misremembers details important to finding confirmation of the incident. That's especially true if he's been telling the story for decades. The brain changes the memory every time it is recalled. So, it's very possible that the "sting" of the story (he thought he was going to die but was at peace) actually happened, but details are misremembered. People's recollection of dramatic events changes over time, especially if they think or talk about them frequently. That's just how brains work.