Mofluencer Wars

[Kishkumen]

First, let me be clear that I'm very much not a fan of Kwaku. I'm not a fan of his tactics, his approach or even his mission. I'm an ex-Mormon myself going on a few years now and I find his schtick to be tired and incredibly overwrought.

Hey, Rosebud! Thanks for dropping by!

[Kishkumen]

Lots of weird posts about John Dehlin. How much of it is true?

At this point, I really don't care. Yawn.

[Bought Yahoo]

Lots of weird posts about John Dehlin. How much of it is true?

At this point, I really don't care. Yawn.

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in terms of sincerity.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Apparently a grown woman is totally helpless and unaccountable for her own choices, making BS excuses along the way. Rosebud does this schtick about once a year, never backs up her claims, paints herself in the best possible light, and then declares herself a victim because she’s, I dunno, desperate to play the victim. Talk about disorders. Ridiculous.

Anyway. Like Dr. Stak mentioned, there’s no way Kookoo sticks around, especially when realizes there’s no way to monetize this weird ass nu mopologist thing he’s doing. He should just focus on his future and work on a legitimate career.

- Doc

[sock puppet]

But John is a classic narcissist -- and I believe he suffers from at least one personality disorder. The more dedicated he became to Mormon Stories, the more dependent he became on it to support him and his family, and the more hellbent on retaining control he became. At this point, very little of John's heart is really in the work. He needs to keep the train moving, the clicks coming and the episodes downloaded in order to survive. He knows this and it keeps him up at night. This explains the inane kind of behavior like calling 911 about an internet meme. He needs the drama.

At the end of the day, John is terrified of becoming irrelevant. He's more terrified of that than he is of being exposed as having had an affair and being an abuser.

There's a ton of great content out there for people trying to find their way out of the church. You don't need to support John and Mormon Stories in order to get out and get out healthy.

You tell a rather sordid tale about John Dehlin personally. For you it is very relevant. For me, it is not as my interest in John Dehlin is not that he is some shining example of how to lead one's personal life. I see Dehlin as useful in bringing interviews of people with different perspectives on Mormonism, and helping people adjust as ex-mo's with as little PTMD as possible.

Dehlin has helped many, many people adjust to becoming ex-mo after discovering that the LDS church, which insists its adherents refrain from so much of life, has been covering up that its founder (even Joseph Smith) did not so refrain himself. For many freshly minted ex-mo's, it would seem Dehlin's been helpful. Of course, YMDV (your mileage does vary) from your experience with Dehlin. Do you plan to resolve that personally and move on, or simply to let it keep eating at you and excoriating him every opportunity you have? (And by resolve that personlly, I mean in any ways that might be appropriate, which might be confronting Dehlin face-to-face.)

[The Stig]

Some interesting feedback from Dehlin's Facebook page (feedback which he accepted, by the way):

John, you have done great things in the last 15 years and you should be rightly proud of it. You rock. I really mean that. I've told you before that you should not apologize for making a living and I'm proud that I helped fund your work in the early days. You should also not pretend to be perfect and claim that all attacks against you are lies. Don't fall into the Trump-like refusal to admit you have made mistakes. They don't negate your good works, which stand on their own.

You had an affair (only one I assume). With an employee. With some awkward/fuzzy/line-crossing moments (as many affairs do). It ended badly. A complaint was filed against you/Open Stories and it was resolved/settled. Your wife and you reconciled and rebuilt and stayed together. You grew. You learned. You have not repeated the mistake (I assume). You continued on and have since done wonderful transformative work. Life goes on. You are human.

Yes, the Church is a cult. Yes, it is swarmy as hell for them to engage in non-stop ad hominem attacks against you. The honest in heart will see through the straw man attacks and the insults and the character assassination and the merits of your work. Let concern for your reputation go and just live authentically without fear--your friends will not abandon you. Your truth will shine through.

But the "it's all lies" defense above sounds too much like Donald Trump. Don't go there.

For the rest of your life, the answer should simply be:

"During the early years of my faith transition, while trying to find my footing in a strange new landscape, I made some mistakes that harmed women. I did not always act in a sexually healthy way. I'm so sorry. I've paid and continue to pay a price for those mistakes, which I view as a joint product of my toxic patriarchal cult upbringing and my inherent ego, arrogance, and libido. I have apologized and continue to apologize for those mistakes, specifically to parties I have harmed and, recognizing that I am a public figure, in general to the public. I no longer make the worst of those mistakes and haven't for many years now. I'm doing better, and I hope to continue to learn and grow in the days to come. I am in awe of my wife's love and support and find incredible joy in our relationship, which is closer than ever. I ask for grace and empathy and forgiveness and I willingly extend the same to all others. I'm not going to let the mistakes I've made in the past stop me from doing important work going forward. If you cannot accept the vital values/messages/stories I promote from me, because of my mistakes, I hope you receive them from others, because they are bigger than me. I'm going to keep working to promote a better, safer, more honest, and more inclusive Mormonism. It might be a small pond, but it is my pond and I want to beautify it as best I can, in spite of the fact that I have, at times, shat in it. It is the best I can do, moving forward."

If that doesn't shut them up, tune them out. Feel free to copy and paste that every time you get attacked. (LOL) But don't just deny deny deny.

Later, this same poster goes on:

I'm saying that it is unnecessary and counterproductive to "call that out" and parsing the mistakes one has made from mistakes one has not made still leaves a stack of mistakes. You could add to the paragraph above: "Many of the specific allegations made against me have been (and will continue to be), unsurprisingly, bald-faced lies--but that doesn't mean I am innocent of wrongdoing."
The link here is way too long and way to defensive and doesn't admit any errors. You deny everything. This is the wrong way to handle it from a PR perspective.

For instance in the link just above, you say "I’ve been accused of breaking up families. . . Literally NONE of these accusations are true." Yet the affair did involve a divorce. Did you "break up the family"? Or was there another more proximate cause? Do you really want to have that argument? No. Of course you don't. So stop the denials and just make a clean apologetic statement for your actual mistakes, much shorter and more humble than the link, and never address it again.

You have got to change your mindset and tone from defending yourself to being truly sorry for your actual mistakes and not worrying for a second about mistakes you did not make. Again, the most valid criticism that is consistently made against you is that you are too arrogant and that weakness shows in the link text and your instinct to deny deny deny. It turns people off and drives them away. And it is unnecessary. Admitting mistakes is good.
For a good example of how to better handle it see Steve Urquhart's approach to his infidelities--likely much much worse than your mistakes.

https://radiowest.kuer.org/post/steve-u ... itual-trip

All the best to you.

I'm not a Dehlin Fan Boy, but his response to this feedback makes me think he's at least open to changing his approach to this situation.

[WhistleBlower]

You tell a rather sordid tale about John Dehlin personally. For you it is very relevant. For me, it is not as my interest in John Dehlin is not that he is some shining example of how to lead one's personal life. I see Dehlin as useful in bringing interviews of people with different perspectives on Mormonism, and helping people adjust as ex-mo's with as little PTMD as possible.

So you're cool with the overall impact of John's work, even if the foundation of that work is based upon lies and fabrication? Sounds familiar.

Do you plan to resolve that personally and move on, or simply to let it keep eating at you and excoriating him every opportunity you have? (And by resolve that personlly, I mean in any ways that might be appropriate, which might be confronting Dehlin face-to-face.)

I plan to speak up about holding John accountable for abusing and mistreating women and for lying in the name of advancing his own personal interests.

I have confronted John face to face about this. He lied to me. To my face. He did what he does with everyone who confronts him about this -- he told me Rosebud was simply "crazy" and that she was "in love with me."

Then I found out the truth. I've read documents and seen things that corroborate that John is a liar an a con-artist.

John knows the truth. He knows these documents exist. And until he publicly acknowledges the truth and makes amends for how he has literally ruined people's lives, this will continue to fester.

[Lem]

First, let me be clear that I'm very much not a fan of Kwaku. I'm not a fan of his tactics, his approach or even his mission. I'm an ex-Mormon myself going on a few years now and I find his schtick to be tired and incredibly overwrought.

The only problem is, despite its sensationalist tone, the central premise of his video exposé of John Dehlin is 100% true.

I know this because I know many of the players involved. I have personally reviewed hundreds of documents, including emails, text messages, Facebook messages and more relating to the Rosebud/John Dehlin affair.

Being one of the two participants helps with knowing the details also, doesn't it?

[The Stig]

You tell a rather sordid tale about John Dehlin personally. For you it is very relevant. For me, it is not as my interest in John Dehlin is not that he is some shining example of how to lead one's personal life. I see Dehlin as useful in bringing interviews of people with different perspectives on Mormonism, and helping people adjust as ex-mo's with as little PTMD as possible.

So you're cool with the overall impact of John's work, even if the foundation of that work is based upon lies and fabrication? Sounds familiar.

Do you plan to resolve that personally and move on, or simply to let it keep eating at you and excoriating him every opportunity you have? (And by resolve that personlly, I mean in any ways that might be appropriate, which might be confronting Dehlin face-to-face.)

I plan to speak up about holding John accountable for abusing and mistreating women and for lying in the name of advancing his own personal interests.

I have confronted John face to face about this. He lied to me. To my face. He did what he does with everyone who confronts him about this -- he told me Rosebud was simply "crazy" and that she was "in love with me."

Then I found out the truth. I've read documents and seen things that corroborate that John is a liar an a con-artist.

John knows the truth. He knows these documents exist. And until he publicly acknowledges the truth and makes amends for how he has literally ruined people's lives, this will continue to fester.

Please stop with the charade that you aren't Rosebud. It's not working.

[WhistleBlower]

Please stop with the charade that you aren't Rosebud. It's not working.

It just kills you that more than one person knows about John's bad behavior, doesn't it? It just eats you up.

What's with all the Dehlin apologists here? Always follow the money...