Problematic John Dehlin, a short list

[Meadowchik]

This is response to request for an elaboration on my claims that Dehlin tends to problematic behaviors. I decided to start a new thread since this topic is more broad than his relationship with Rosebud.

1)Open Stories Foundation impropriety and his responses since: including the Rosebud drama, the disagreements with Amy Grubbs (under NDA) and Kristy Money. Much of that seems to be a pattern of seeking free or underpaid labor, and then running into trouble when people don't like how they're treated. Dehlin seems to have a habit of needing to get rid of all or most everyone at Open Stories Foundation, refilling the positions, then having to purge again.

https://dearjohndehlin.wordpress.com/tag/kate-kelly/
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1385 ... 21729.html
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1335 ... 87272.html

2)Professional grey area in representing himself. Dehlin touts his Phd in clinical and counselling psychology yet to this day remains unlicensed to practice therapy in Utah. He gets around this by calling his services “coaching.” What he is doing might be technically legal in Utah, but I think we can say it is ethically questionable.

https://www.johndehlin.com/coaching/

3)Pretending to be anti-misogynist then silencing women who hold him to account. He explicitly asks for feedback and ends up deleting, muting, or blocking dozens of women who raise legitimate concerns about his own behavior. He and his friends do this in several groups in response to criticism of him.

4)Centering himself continually, like when Michael Quinn passed away, he was one of the earliest to post the news, and he did it before Quinn’s family.

He has a personal problem which ends up hurting people: he has built his livelihood around this while not being competent enough to de-center himself. He therefore invites (not just attacks from believers or smears) legitimate criticisms. But instead of really responding to consumer feedback like a competent professional, he reacts in Mormon-authoritarian fashion. He’s perpetuating those unhealthy behaviors. His media reach amplifies that and the damage such behavior causes, both the potential for damage and the actual harm.

Ideally, Dehlin would be more responsive to criticism. But at the very least, hopefully more of us can continue to unlearn the very Mormon tendency to look for a male authority figure and be more circumspect about who we support. Ultimately, I hope for multiple communities of broader support, communities with less infighting and more self-awareness.

[Bought Yahoo]

I dunno. He seems a decent fellow just trying to make a buck. If folks want to work for him for free why not.

He doesn't need a license to counsel people about religion.

[consiglieri]

Ultimately, I hope for multiple communities of broader support, communities with less infighting and more self-awareness.

Did you really end your infighting post with that last sentence?

[Lem]

... But at the very least, hopefully more of us can continue to unlearn the very Mormon tendency to look for a male authority figure and be more circumspect about who we support....

It's not just a Mormon tendency, but your point is well made that it is engrained into the Mormon upbringing. There are many problems inherent in the regular admonition that one should first and foremost "listen to the priesthood" when making decisions in one's life.

[Meadowchik]

Did you really end your infighting post with that last sentence?

Why do you think my post is an infighting post? Is it hidden? Is it competing for power in a finite power structure?

[Meadowchik]

It's not just a Mormon tendency, but your point is well made that it is engrained into the Mormon upbringing. There are many problems inherent in the regular admonition that one should first and foremost "listen to the priesthood" when making decisions in one's life.

Yup, it's certainly not uniquely Mormon, but it is very, very Mormon!

[Kukulkan]

Were any of the people who are upset about payment promised payment but never received it? Or is it that they expected payment for what they did but were never offered payment? I think there is a big difference.

[Kukulkan]

podcasters are not salaried employees (rather, they are outside contractors provided no benefits and paid relative pennies per download, on the justification that Open Stories Foundation is based in Utah, a right-to-work state).

I mean, this seems fair to me. Your podcast does well = you get paid more. You podcast doesn't do well = you don't get paid more. MS podcast is most likely the primary source of income for the Open Stories Foundation so I don't see how it is unfair that John Dehlin receives most of the revenue. We have no evidence to suggest that if a Open Stories Foundation podcast other than MS became super popular that payment would continue on the meritocratic system and not move to a salary based position.

[pistolero]

Someone should self publish a biography of John Dehlin. A lot of people have clearly spent a lot of time pouring over his life and analysing his behaviour. It reminds me a bit of the flack that DCP gets. I guess that's what happens when you're in the cross hairs.

Just saying. I'll commit to buying a copy here and now.

Also, just to spice this new thread up, can we move it to the Telestial forum, so we can discuss some of the R/NC-17 of his behaviour? I still have some questions I'd like to explore.

[Meadowchik]

Were any of the people who are upset about payment promised payment but never received it? Or is it that they expected payment for what they did but were never offered payment? I think there is a big difference.

I think that Kristy Money answered this:

https://dearjohndehlin.wordpress.com/tag/kate-kelly/

This apparently precipitated a dispute between Dehlin and Money. Presumably, Dehlin was angry with Money disclosing that fact that he wasn’t giving her any… …money for her podcasting labors in behalf of the organization. Kelly described the results of her posting Money’s not being paid for her services, “She supported me posting it, but didn’t speak out directly herself because she feared severe retribution… which, sadly, happened anyway. As a result of talking about her compensation to others (even privately), Kristy’s relationship as a podcaster with Mormon Stories ended. Her podcast Mormon Transitions (that shwas the initial podcaster of & worked for months to build) was taken over by John Dehlin’s wife.” It does seem ironic that, in an organization that touts transparency as a concept, Money’s disclosing her non-salary would constitute grounds for retribution, as Kelly suggests. The takeover of the podcast by Dehlin’s wife around this time certainly seems to circumstantially support this reading of events. It might stand to reason that if the salary’s becoming public knowledge wasn’t acceptable then it is probably the case that on some level Dehlin understood that the non-salary itself wasn’t really acceptable. This does seem to support Kelly’s subsequent assertion that, “I know that institutions never change unless there are real consequences [KK2].” In any event, Kristy Money, “left the Open Stories Foundation in late 2016” [M1] as, apparently, a direct consequence of the retaliatory fallout of the confrontation between Kelly and Dehlin.
On May 20th Kristy Money published an open letter on her Facebook. This letter is copied here in full with no editing beyond possible losses of formatting during copying (this source is subsequently referred to as [M1]):
————————————-Money Quote [M1]——————————-
Since I left the Open Stories Foundation in late 2016, a lot of people have asked me what happened. I have deliberated for months on what to say and how to say it—I have tried repeatedly to express my concerns privately to both John Dehlin and Open Stories Foundation to no avail. So even in the midst of painful morning sickness with baby #5 and cross-country family move fog, I feel it’s time to publicly call on Dr. Dehlin to release detailed Open Stories Foundation financials for 2016 and annually in perpetuity. Especially if he is going to continue to assert that Open Stories Foundation is on a shoestring budget and he is not unduly profiting from it financially (i.e. inurement). Here are the concerns I have based on my experience:

-In late 2016, Open Stories Foundation completely revamped their pay structure for podcasters so that, while Dr. Dehlin continues to draw a regular base salary as CEO–with further unknown financial benefit from co-hosting podcasts with members of his household, collecting speaking fees for retreats, and performance bonuses–podcasters are not salaried employees (rather, they are outside contractors provided no benefits and paid relative pennies per download, on the justification that Open Stories Foundation is based in Utah, a right-to-work state). This change also coincides with the first year that Open Stories Foundation has not been transparent about its finances and the substantially large retreats began.

-Moderators who donate hours upon hours per week of their own time to moderate official Open Stories Foundation groups and funnel/support members into his organization have been invited to Open Stories Foundation banquets, but only if they pay for their food.

-I have come to know many individuals who were never paid by Dr. Dehlin for professional services they did for him personally and Open Stories Foundation as an organization that they were promised.

For my own time and travel to speak at a NYC Open Stories Foundation retreat, I was only comped for my flight—and only after sending 5+ reminder emails over 3 months.

-I was present when individuals who work for Dr. Dehlin have been brought to tears from how he treated them for privately (in a very small group) expressing concerns about his behavior. Our witnessing their treatment seemed to me a warning that we would be treated similarly if he perceived our loyalty to be lacking.

I have seen Open Stories Foundation’s work be a force for good in the lives of people I care about, like my dear husband. At the same time, especially in light of recent events (like John’s organizing of luxury retreats in the Bahamas and Australia) and his demand for loyalty and not answering for his behavior when approached privately, I regrettably must do this publicly. If Dr. Dehlin continues to criticize the church saying that it’s not financially transparent, a non-profit that acts like a for-profit, not helping those in need with excess funds that are instead put elsewhere (details unknown), etc., then it’s important that he hold his own non-profit institution to the same standard. When I was deliberating whether or not to stay with Open Stories Foundation last Nov. when issues between John and Kate Kelly unfolded, both John and the Open Stories Foundation board told me that we can’t let John’s reputation risk tarnishing, because if that happens, “the Church wins.” I don’t feel comfortable giving a pass and allowing an institutional culture like that within Open Stories Foundation leadership. Encouragement from the top to give problematic behavior from leaders “a break” sounds too familiar. My only goal is for this open letter to Dr. Dehlin to lead to positive change. I hope it will.