Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

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_Droopy
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _Droopy »

Kevin Graham wrote:
Droopy, your side lied.


No, actually, they didn't, and we know they didn't. The facts and documentation, thus far, are in. The timeline, the phone calls, the stand down orders, the altered talking points, the two week cavalcade of deception, all of it. This is settled fact, not hypothesis, not theory. Fight against facts if you feel you must, but it is your credibility that will lie face down in the gutter in the end.
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_Kevin Graham
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _Kevin Graham »

Asserting stupid things won't pull you out of the stupid column Droopy. If you can't even admit the overwhelmingly demonstrable fact that the emails were completely misrepresented, then you're quite simply, an idiot. It is really frightening to see what kind of people the Right Wing bubble produce. I mean, you actually believe this crap. :lol:
_Droopy
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _Droopy »

Kevin Graham wrote:Asserting stupid things won't pull you out of the stupid column Droopy. If you can't even admit the overwhelmingly demonstrable fact that the emails were completely misrepresented, then you're quite simply, an idiot. It is really frightening to see what kind of people the Right Wing bubble produce. I mean, you actually believe this s***. :lol:



They do not appear to have been misrepresented, as the two-week deception/apology spree using precisely the meme critics have pointed out was inaugurated in the emails as the official party line seems to make quite clear. That became the official narrative and it was continued, on and on, until facts and documentary evidence made further mendacity impossible.
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell
_Res Ipsa
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _Res Ipsa »

Droopy wrote:
Kevin Graham wrote:Asserting stupid things won't pull you out of the stupid column Droopy. If you can't even admit the overwhelmingly demonstrable fact that the emails were completely misrepresented, then you're quite simply, an idiot. It is really frightening to see what kind of people the Right Wing bubble produce. I mean, you actually believe this s***. :lol:



They do not appear to have been misrepresented, as the two-week deception/apology spree using precisely the meme critics have pointed out was inaugurated in the emails as the official party line seems to make quite clear. That became the official narrative and it was continued, on and on, until facts and documentary evidence made further mendacity impossible.


TL/DR: I got nothing, so I'm stuck with denying reality.
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_Kevin Graham
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _Kevin Graham »

Kevin Graham wrote:
1. How hard was that? Why did it take so much time? The timing was obviously meant to distract.

The emails had been released to the media quite some time ago. However, Obama underestimated the power of Right Wing stupidity and their willingness to "summarize" those emails in a very dishonest way for their own purposes.
2. Where are the emails from the two days after the attack?

Ah, so now that your over-hyped sources have proven to be complete disasters, including both the "whistleblowers" and the emails, you're now going to imply that a smoking gun still exists, but that it has to be found somewhere in emails that haven't been released.
3. We now know (as if anyone didn't already) that Jim Carney is a liar. From these emails, we know that it is absolutely untrue the White House and the State Department made only minor changes that Carney claimed was the case only six days ago.

That's a stretch to say the least. You've failed to demonstrate any serious editing or a political motive for doing so. The Weekly Standard piece was already shown to be so incompetent, that it overlooked the fact that its own version of the emails refuted the main point it was trying to make.
4. The truth is that the CIA got it right the first time by referencing "Islamic extremists with ties to Al Qaeda".


It also got it right by referencing the CAIRO protests: "We believe based on currently available information that the attacks in Benghazi were spontaneously inspired by the protests at the U.S Embassy in Cairo and evolved into a direct assault.

Ya. Kinda like what Rice and company had said from the beginning. Your precious Right Wing media ignored this and declared a cover up based on this ignorance alone.

6. We know that:
"Victoria Nuland expressed repeated concerns about the talking points. The CIA says in the emails, “The State Department had major reservations with much or most of the document.” Under the pressure of a revised version, Nuland continued to push back writing, "These don't resolve all my issues or those of my building leadership.” Nuland's involvement also includes concerns that the original point about repeated warnings “could be abused by members (of Congress) to beat the State Department for not paying attention to agency warnings so why do we want to feed that either? Concerned..."

It is funny that you link us to the emails and then proceed to explain what's in them as if you've actually read them. But you obviously haven't or else you'd know that your citation is a complete fabrication by The Weekly Standard writer Stephen Hayes. And your exact quotation exists on only one other place on the entire internet: The Sean Hannity website!

This is what Hayes said: "According to the email, several officials in the meeting shared the concern of Nuland, who was not part of the deliberations, that the CIA's talking points might lead to criticism that the State Department had ignored the CIA's warning about an attack."

The email doesn't actually say that-- rather, it indicates that the concern was that the initial draft would lead readers to "infer incorrectly that the CIA had warned about a specific attack on our embassy." It makes no mention of perceived criticism of the "State Department."

The idea that Nuland's overriding concern was political -- and that her concern was shared by the White House -- is key to the notion of a "cover-up" by the administration. Hayes' articles came to that assumption based on incomplete information and misrepresentation of emails between agencies.
7. General Petraeus about the talking points: “Frankly, I’d just as soon not use this.”

Yes, but what your liars in the Right Wing media refuse to say is why he said this.
8. Nowhere in the emails is there any mention of a YouTube video.

You wouldn't know, because all you're doing is citing commentary from Hayes, the same guy who just lied to you about Nuland's email and now he is lying about this.

The Los Angeles Times noted of the emails: "Even the very first version of the talking points suggests that the attack was inspired by the protests in Cairo over the anti-Muslim video, a perfectly plausible supposition at the time. That undermines the Republican claim that administration officials concocted the notion of a Benghazi protest to protect the president from a perception that Al Qaeda was ascendant again." Indeed, the original version of the talking points produced by the CIA's Office of Terrorism Analysis stated:
The currently available information suggests that the demonstrations in Benghazi were spontaneously inspired by the protests at the U.S. Embassy in Cairo and evolved into a direct assault against the U.S. diplomatic post and subsequently its annex. There are indications that extremists participated in the violent demonstrations

No surprise then, that Stephen Hayes, the guy who has been lying about this all along, is all over the FOX News shows speaking as an authority on this subject. Like Weekly Standard, you posted the evidence (the emails) proving your own argument was full of baloney, but you didn't realize it because you never actually read them. All you do is cut and paste the latest from the Right Wing propaganda bulletin.
What this means is that narrative did not come from the CIA. It was a desperate political decision.

No, it means you're too lazy to read the emails which prove your preferred sources are liars.
7. General Petraeus about the talking points: “Frankly, I’d just as soon not use this.”

Again, this is a failure to cite his concern in context. The fact is he didn't like the talking points because they didn't do enough to connect the attacks to the video. In context he said, "We couldn't even mention the Cairo warning. But it's their call.'"
9. Who gave the stand down orders and where was the President at the time?


There were no such orders.



I'll take bcspace's silence as a concession he is wrong on every single point he raised in the Op Ed.
_bcspace
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _bcspace »

It has long been part of the Washington game for officials to discredit a news story by playing up errors in a relatively small part of it. Pfeiffer gives the impression that GOP operatives deliberately tried to “smear the president” with false, doctored e-mails.

But the reporters involved have indicated they were told by their sources that these were summaries, taken from notes of e-mails that could not be kept. The fact that slightly different versions of the e-mails were reported by different journalists suggests there were different note-takers as well.

Indeed, Republicans would have been foolish to seriously doctor e-mails that the White House at any moment could have released (and eventually did). Clearly, of course, Republicans would put their own spin on what the e-mails meant, as they did in the House report. Given that the e-mails were almost certain to leak once they were sent to Capitol Hill, it’s a wonder the White House did not proactively release them earlier.

The burden of proof lies with the accuser. Despite Pfeiffer’s claim of political skullduggery, we see little evidence that much was at play here besides imprecise wordsmithing or editing errors by journalists.

Image

Factchecker Destroys White House Claim of 'Doctored' Benghazi Emails


It's absolutely incredible what the Left will do to hide or change truth. More egg on the face of Media Matters and the Obama administration. The scandal continues to broaden, confirming Bob Woodward's comparison.
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_Kevin Graham
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _Kevin Graham »

It's absolutely incredible what the Left will do to hide or change truth. More egg on the face of Media Matters and the Obama administration.


So let's see. Your talking points in this thread were shown to be based on false information, in the form of email "summaries" as opposed to the actual emails themselves.

Even though you falsely claimed the actual emails made the case for your talking points, you're going to sit there and say the "egg" is on the faces of those who pointed out the fact that your scandal-mongering was based on inaccurate representations of those emails!

You're also going to take for granted a silly article by the usual "pot-stirring" Kessler, claiming the White House is wrong to accuse Republicans of lying about the emails, because in his opinion, they didn't really mean to misrepresent those emails because they were only provided "summaries." Notice he isn't challenging the claim that your talking points are based on bogus data. He is only challenging the claim that it was a Republican source who edited them in such a way.

And here is another problem. Kessler doesn't explain the fact that no one claimed to have been reading edited "summaries" of emails this whole time. They claimed to be quoting the actual emails themselves. The few references using the word "summaries" doesn't mean they were no longer claiming to have the actual emails. Not once did ABC or Weekly Standard say,

After all, they used the "summaries" to prove certain things had been "scrubbed" through revisions. So obviously they were trying to convey the message that they had read the actual emails, which was going to put them in a position to determine what had been "scrubbed."

The scandal continues to broaden, confirming Bob Woodward's comparison.


WTF?

You just provided a "factcheck" opinion piece that, even if 100% true, only says the Republicans didn't mean to misrepresent the emails. It still concedes the point that talking points leading up to last week were based on a misrepresentation of what the actual emails had said.
_bcspace
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Re: Benghazi Email Dump Pours More Fuel On the Scandal Fire

Post by _bcspace »

Looks like we now may have a case of incest added to this.

Wow: CBS News President and White House Official Tied to Benghazi Scandal Are Brothers

I suppose it depends on whether or not David Rhodes is a "down the middle" guy.
Machina Sublime
Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
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