Her Father must be very proud

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_Maksutov
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Re: Her Father must be very proud

Post by _Maksutov »

honorentheos wrote:
Chap wrote:Speaking for myself, I don't rule out completely the possibility that someone, sometime may manage to describe some version of the Abrahamic deity in terms that make sense, and then convince me that such an entity actually exists. But I have heard and read a lot of attempts to do one or both of those things, and found all of them unconvincing. Given that life is short, energy is limited, and there are many more profitable and interesting things to do than keep on reading reams and reams of theist apologetics, I don't propose to devote much further attention to the topic, not because I think I think I am omniscient, but because I am frankly a bit bored with the whole business.

You can speak for me on this, too. Very well said.


Yes indeed.
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov
_Some Schmo
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Re: Her Father must be very proud

Post by _Some Schmo »

Chap wrote:Speaking for myself, I don't rule out completely the possibility that someone, sometime may manage to describe some version of the Abrahamic deity in terms that make sense, and then convince me that such an entity actually exists. But I have heard and read a lot of attempts to do one or both of those things, and found all of them unconvincing. Given that life is short, energy is limited, and there are many more profitable and interesting things to do than keep on reading reams and reams of theist apologetics, I don't propose to devote much further attention to the topic, not because I think I think I am omniscient, but because I am frankly a bit bored with the whole business.

This is the thing religious people can't seem to wrap their heads around; that their very special personal philosophy is not special to everyone, that it is, in fact, pretty silly and boring from the outside looking in. It's like thinking an adult must have some kind of special animosity toward cartoons if they don't watch SpongeBob.

What's really strange about it is that they could relate to it if they took a moment to examine how they feel about all the other religions they think are wrong.
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
_canpakes
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Re: Her Father must be very proud

Post by _canpakes »

Amore wrote:And there are so many religions and so many interpretations of God that to claim to know them all thoroughly enough to deny them all would be pretending self-omniscience.

You have it backwards.

Many folks who'd call themselves atheists freely accept the idea that there does not exist any person who knows the true nature of God regardless of so many religions attempting to make that claim. Thus atheists make no claim to omniscience.

For the faithful, the situation differs. The folks who claim to be a member of a 'one true faith', for example, perfectly fits your description. They've affirmatively denied all faiths but one to state their belief that the one has the answers to questions that they imagine God would create for them.
_Chap
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Re: Her Father must be very proud

Post by _Chap »

canpakes wrote:They've affirmatively denied all faiths but one to state their belief that the one has the answers to questions that they imagine God would create for them.


I'd like to call attention to the very interesting implications of the bolded words above.

One of the people I have referred to earlier - in whose upbringing religious belief and practice has played no role - reacts to discussions of the tenets of her local and other religions by saying, in effect, 'But to what interesting or important questions is all this stuff supposed to be an answer?'.

In the letters of Paul, his version of Christianity is presented (I hope I do not caricature overmuch) as in part an answer to the question 'There is an entity called Yahweh, who as us Jews all know is infinitely just and righteous, and who is angered by human sinfulness. How can I avoid his punishment for my admitted and persistent failure to measure up to the standard his perfection demands?'.

But if you don't think there is such an entity, there is no need for Pauline Christianity. Similarly, if there is no wheel of rebirth and burden of karma to escape from what is Buddhism for?

People who advocate for the religion they were brought up in (which is the huge majority of religion advocates) usually assume that everybody accepts as real and pressing the problems that their religion claims to solve. But the weakness of religious claims goes back a stage further than that.
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
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