Climate Change is a Hoax

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_canpakes
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _canpakes »

SPG wrote:
canpakes wrote:Interesting argument.

“Co2 levels were much more screwed up 800,000 years ago, and the people that did not exist weren’t bothered by it”.

How does anyone look at a mirror and tell themself that this is a sound argument?

This argument goes deeper then people want to look into, thus they want to call deniers "stupid."

There are parts of the planet that are warming, parts that are freezing over. That many parts in the north are melting is pretty obviously, but not something we can really do anything about. Whether is effected by other things then humans, as stated in the "quoted" phrase.

But the polar ice caps are melting on Mars too. Did we cause that? The storms on Jupiter and Saturn are changing, surface temp up almost 20 degrees on the big planets.

The hoax, is that if we give a government enough power to regulate all of the affairs of humanity, we can stop this. Normally, the oceans would be able to deal the CO2, but massive parts of coral reef are dying, which by itself releases massive amounts of carbon.

But the north is melting, MASSIVE amounts of methane are being released from the tundra, we cannot refreeze the north, even if we could stop the production of carbon. The earth is in a cycle, there is NOTHING we can do change that. I base that on the fact other planets are warming too, and we don't know how to cool them down.

So act all righteous if you want, but you don't understand is going on any more then anyone else.


SPG, I’m not too worried about the situation on Mars.

But to be truthful is to acknowledge that virtually no one believes that we can control the climate. That’s not what the argument is about. Rather, the concern is that we modify our resource use to not favorably bias those things that cause the greatest rate of change, and that we look at what we may be having an effect on already in order to prepare for the outcome.

That’s not ‘righteous’. It’s responsible, and humane.
_Maksutov
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Maksutov »

SPG wrote:But the polar ice caps are melting on Mars too. Did we cause that? The storms on Jupiter and Saturn are changing, surface temp up almost 20 degrees on the big planets.

....

So act all righteous if you want, but you don't understand is going on any more then anyone else.


SPG, your ignorance is not shared by everyone. Knowledge is not about righteousness. If you don't understand that climate change is about conditions on our planet, you might as well go back to your comic books. :lol:

If you want to know about the conditions on other planets, study Astronomy. You have a few centuries of catching up to do, so you'd better get started. :razz:
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov
_Maksutov
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Maksutov »

EAllusion wrote:I think you should think less about how arrogant and stupid Rep. Massie is and how broken the system is that it elevates him to one of the most powerful people in the country. Like Donald Trump, it's easy to gawk at how unbelievably stupid the words coming out of his mouth is, but really, what is happening when the system rewards him for being who he is?


It reminded me of Mike Lee's "get married and have babies" solution to all problems. :rolleyes:
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov
_Doctor Steuss
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Doctor Steuss »

SPG wrote:But the polar ice caps are melting on Mars too. Did we cause that?

The receding ice caps on Mars is a yearly event. Mars' ice caps are made up partially of carbon dioxide ice (or, as us Earth folk call it during parties... "dry ice"). It doesn't take much for that kind of ice cap receding party to get kicked off.
"Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead." ~Charles Bukowski
_Maksutov
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Maksutov »

https://skepticalscience.com/solar-acti ... ediate.htm

In the last 35 years of global warming, the sun has shown a slight cooling trend. Sun and climate have been going in opposite directions.

Climate Myth...
It's the sun
"Over the past few hundred years, there has been a steady increase in the numbers of sunspots, at the time when the Earth has been getting warmer. The data suggests solar activity is influencing the global climate causing the world to get warmer." (BBC)

As supplier of almost all the energy in Earth's climate, the sun has a strong influence on climate. A comparison of sun and climate over the past 1150 years found temperatures closely match solar activity (Usoskin 2005). However, after 1975, temperatures rose while solar activity showed little to no long-term trend. This led the study to conclude, "...during these last 30 years the solar total irradiance, solar UV irradiance and cosmic ray flux has not shown any significant secular trend, so that at least this most recent warming episode must have another source."

In fact, a number of independent measurements of solar activity indicate the sun has shown a slight cooling trend since 1960, over the same period that global temperatures have been warming. Over the last 35 years of global warming, sun and climate have been moving in opposite directions. An analysis of solar trends concluded that the sun has actually contributed a slight cooling influence in recent decades (Lockwood 2008).
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov
_canpakes
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _canpakes »

The Right keeps placing itself farther and farther on the wrong side of both science and morality with this topic ...


Climate scientists drive stake through heart of skeptics' argument

New research shows that the recent rise in global temperatures is unlike anything seen on Earth during the past 2,000 years.
by Jaclyn Jeffrey-Wilensky | NBC NEWS

Global warming skeptics sometimes say rising temperatures are just another naturally occurring shift in Earth’s climate, like the Medieval Warm Period of the years 800 to 1200 or the Little Ice Age, a period of cooling that spanned from roughly 1300 to 1850.

But a pair of studies published Wednesday provides stark evidence that the rise in global temperatures over the past 150 years has been far more rapid and widespread than any warming period in the past 2,000 years — a finding that undercuts claims that today’s global warming isn’t necessarily the result of human activity.

“The familiar maxim that the climate is always changing is certainly true,” Scott St. George, a physical geographer at the University of Minnesota in Minneapolis, said in a written commentary about the studies. “But even when we push our perspective to the earliest days of the Roman Empire, we cannot discern any event that is remotely equivalent — either in degree or extent — to the warming over the last few decades.”

Since the beginning of the 20th century, the global average temperature on Earth has risen by about 2 degrees Fahrenheit. A consensus of climate scientists pins the increase primarily on the burning of fossil fuels, which spews carbon dioxide and other heat-trapping greenhouse gases into the air. In the absence of concerted efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, the United Nations says, the global average temperature could rise an additional 5.4 to 9 degrees Fahrenheit by 2100.

One of the studies, published in the journal Nature, shows that the Little Ice Age and other natural fluctuations affected only limited regions of the planet at a time, making modern warming the first and only planetwide warm period in the past two millennia. The other study, published in Nature Geoscience, shows that the rate of modern warming has far outpaced changes that occurred before the rise of the industrial era.

For the research, a team led by Raphael Neukom, a postdoctoral researcher at the University of Bern’s Institute of Geography in Switzerland, analyzed 2,000 years' worth of climate data. In the absence of direct temperature information — thermometer measurements were scarce before the middle of the 19th century — the scientists looked at data on old trees’ growth rings, layers of glacier ice and the remnants of corals, whose layers have different chemical compositions depending on the temperature of seawater.

The Nature study mapped the temperature fluctuations across the planet, finding, for example, that the Little Ice Age didn’t affect the whole world at once. Temperatures bottomed out in the Pacific Ocean around 1500, the scientists found; Europe and North America didn’t fully chill out for another two centuries.

The same pattern was observed for the higher temperatures seen during the Medieval Warm Period. The researchers found that less than half of the planet felt the heat at once.

The research indicates that during the current period of warming, more than 98 percent of the Earth’s surface has experienced record high temperatures. The finding shows just how dramatically today’s global rise in temperatures differs from previous periods of temperature change, the scientists said.

“What we show is that these periods aren’t globally coherent as previously thought,” said Nathan Steiger, a climate scientist at Columbia University in New York City and a co-author of the Nature study. The current period of warming “stands in stark contrast” to today’s warming, he added, calling it “a globally coherent warm period that is very different from what we see in the past.”

For the Nature Geoscience study, the researchers charted global temperature averages over time, and then compared the data to a set of climate simulations to figure out what might have driven the changes. Neukom and his colleagues found that the fastest warming in the last two millennia occurred during the second half of the 20th century.

The researchers also found that the main cause of temperature fluctuations changed over time. Prior to 1850, fluctuations were mainly linked to volcanic eruptions, which cooled the planet by spewing sun-blocking ash into the stratosphere; after 1850, greenhouse gas emissions took the wheel.

“It’s exciting to see studies like this that combine rigorous statistics with huge databases to make clear conclusions about past climate change,” said Gabriela Serrato Marks, a graduate student in paleoclimatology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, Massachusetts, who wasn't involved in the new research.

Serrato Marks said the records the researchers used could be incomplete, adding that subsequent research could benefit from more robust data. “Future studies will be strengthened even more with data from the Southern Hemisphere and more high-resolution data,” she said.

Jennifer Hertzberg, a paleoclimatologist at Old Dominion University in Norfolk, Virginia, who wasn’t involved in the research, called the study “very important” and praised its use of multiple statistical methods to reconstruct temperature change over time. She urged the public to take the results to heart.

“The global temperatures that we’re seeing now are higher than they have been in the last 2,000 years,” she said. “What we’re seeing now is uncharted territory. It’s time for everybody to wake up and make changes now.”
_Chap
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Chap »

canpakes wrote:The Right keeps placing itself farther and farther on the wrong side of both science and morality with this topic ...


Climate scientists drive stake through heart of skeptics' argument

New research shows that the recent rise in global temperatures is unlike anything seen on Earth during the past 2,000 years.
by Jaclyn Jeffrey-Wilensky | NBC NEWS


[...]

“The global temperatures that we’re seeing now are higher than they have been in the last 2,000 years,” she said. “What we’re seeing now is uncharted territory. It’s time for everybody to wake up and make changes now.”


It's now clear that the anti-American Trump-hating job-killers of the scientists' climate conspiracy are ramping up the lies.

There is only one way to deal with this. And that's to make it illegal to spread climate panic rumours. We need a climate equivalent of ICE to raid the offices of lying scientists and the so-called 'peer reviewed' journals like Science and Nature that disseminate their propaganda.

Any suggestions for a name for this body of sterling citizens? How about Climate Untruths Suppression, for instance? Could be the basis of a catchy little acronym ...
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_Gunnar
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Gunnar »

According to NASA studies, when you graph all the known individual natural factors affecting climate change, both those that should be causing cooling and those that should be causing warming, and calculate their combined predicted effects, and combine them with the predicted effects of human caused factors, you wind up with a graph that closely approximates the graph of actually observed warming trends. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy9ZIsFqo2c

See also Scientist Laughs at Climate Change Skeptics. Pay particular attention her answer to the claim that climate scientists are somehow getting rich by warning of climate change. Few things are more laughable than that! Katherine Hayhoe would make a lot more money by working as a petroleum geologist for a major oil company or writing articles to discredit climate change concerns at the request of the heritage association or other conservative organizations funded by the fossil fuel industry to deny climate change--the very same dishonest organizations that tried to dismiss the dangers of tobacco at the behest of Big Tobacco.
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.

“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
_Gunnar
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Gunnar »

Chap wrote:There is only one way to deal with this. And that's to make it illegal to spread climate panic rumours. We need a climate equivalent of ICE to raid the offices of lying scientists and the so-called 'peer reviewed' journals like Science and Nature that disseminate their propaganda.

Any suggestions for a name for this body of sterling citizens? How about Climate Untruths Suppression, for instance? Could be the basis of a catchy little acronym ...

Actually, the opposite is happening. The Trump administration has banned the use of words like "science based" and "evidence based" in official government reports and papers.
The Trump administration has reportedly banned the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) from using the phrases “evidence-based” and “science-based” in official documents.

Senior CDC officials distributed the list of “forbidden” words and phrases to policy analysts at the CDC on Thursday, The Washington Post reported Friday. The list also bans the use of “vulnerable,” “entitlement,” “diversity,” “transgender” and “fetus.”

Analysts are reportedly prohibited from using the phrases in official documents they prepare for the 2019 budget, which is expected to be released in February.

An analyst who attended the meeting at the CDC in Atlanta told The Washington Post that instead of “evidence-based” or “science-based,” policy analysts are instructed to use the phrase, “CDC bases its recommendations on science in consideration with community standards and wishes.”

The analyst told the Post that other branches of President Trump’s health department are likely adhering to the same list of banned words. The source said that others at the meeting reacted with surprise when given the list.

“It was very much, ‘Are you serious? Are you kidding?’ ” the analyst said, “In my experience, we’ve never had any pushback from an ideological standpoint.”

The Trump administration has been repeatedly scrutinized for declining to acknowledge scientific findings, particularly related to climate change. Trump has also repeatedly expressed doubts about the scientific consensus that humans are the main cause of a warming planet. Numerous members of his administration and his appointees have also denied aspects of the scientific consensus related to global warming.


See also: The Trump administration's solution to climate change: ban the term
No precept or claim is more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.

“If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; but if you really make them think, they'll hate you.”
― Harlan Ellison
_Chap
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Re: Climate Change is a Hoax

Post by _Chap »

Gunnar wrote:
Chap wrote:There is only one way to deal with this. And that's to make it illegal to spread climate panic rumours. We need a climate equivalent of ICE to raid the offices of lying scientists and the so-called 'peer reviewed' journals like Science and Nature that disseminate their propaganda.

Any suggestions for a name for this body of sterling citizens? How about Climate Untruths Suppression, for instance? Could be the basis of a catchy little acronym ...

Actually, the opposite is happening. The Trump administration has banned the use of words like "science based" and "evidence based" in official government reports and papers.


I think you may have misunderstood the ironic intent of my post.
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
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