Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

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_Chap
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _Chap »

EAllusion wrote: ...the real takeaway here is that [you] genuinely didn't know that people do work full time or more than full-time and lack a liveable income. That's reality for some people. How much money you make isn't a simple function of how hard you work.


It's surprising how many people can't get their head round the idea that some employers really do get people to work for them at wages that, after a week's hard full-time work, do not give them enough to live at any semblance of decency. As a result, of course, the goods and services that such people produce can be sold to the Majax at attractive prices - so Majax has the pleasure of abusing the lazy poor while enjoying the cheap fruits of their about.

I mean, that's a win-win, right?
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

Chap wrote:
EAllusion wrote: ...the real takeaway here is that [you] genuinely didn't know that people do work full time or more than full-time and lack a liveable income. That's reality for some people. How much money you make isn't a simple function of how hard you work.


It's surprising how many people can't get their head round the idea that some employers really do get people to work for them at wages that, after a week's hard full-time work, do not give them enough to live at any semblance of decency. As a result, of course, the goods and services that such people produce can be sold to the Majax at attractive prices - so Majax has the pleasure of abusing the lazy poor while enjoying the cheap fruits of their about.

I mean, that's a win-win, right?


What if the employer himself is barely scraping by, or worse, in massive debt? How does he pay more?

- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_Xenophon
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _Xenophon »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
What if the employer himself is barely scraping by, or worse, in massive debt? How does he pay more?

- Doc

Chap was probably mostly referring to large corporations that have considerable profit margins that continue to pay as low a wage as possible. You raise a good point though that many small businesses do struggle to pay what their employees are "worth". I'll note anecdotally that most small to mid-size businesses acknowledge that and try to find other perks to offer, also most people that work for them understand that and do so for other reasons.

There is a reason that some countries are experimenting with basic income stipends and I think that is one solution. I'm probably more in favor of tax breaks filling the gap, but I'm willing to change my mind on that. Frankly, whether business pay enough or not aside, we will need to figure out a basic income strategy that accounts for automation I don't think we have many lawmakers that it has even crossed their minds.
"If you consider what are called the virtues in mankind, you will find their growth is assisted by education and cultivation." -Xenophon of Athens
_canpakes
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _canpakes »

Xenophon wrote:
Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
What if the employer himself is barely scraping by, or worse, in massive debt? How does he pay more?

- Doc

Chap was probably mostly referring to large corporations that have considerable profit margins that continue to pay as low a wage as possible.

A good illustration of this is the short (two minute) and snappy video at the link below that examines just how much Walmart would have to raise their prices in order to pay their workforce no less than about $15.00 per hour. The amount of the cost increase will probably surprise most folks...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAcaeLmybCY

The end result would not only serve to pay their team members what some would arguably call a 'living wage' (a subjective term, for sure) but would also have the secondary effect of paying them enough for most to not fall into the eligibility range of SNAP assistance. You'd think that folks like ajax would be all over this idea, especially given that Walmart - if they were doing this - would not be socializing their payroll cost with everyone in town regardless of being a Walmart customer or not. Walmart's customers, instead, would be fully supporting that workforce through their purchases of adequately-priced products. That seems like a sound conservative principle of being responsible for and compensating others for what you use. Otherwise, isn't Walmart stealing from the larger community that is now expending tax dollars to provide SNAP assistance to Walmart employees that qualify for it based upon their fairly dismal wages?

Another example comes from the fast food industry. If Mickey Dee's had to raise the cost of their burgers and fries to a level that allowed them to keep the same abundant profit levels while also paying their workforce a minimum of 15.00 an hour (this amount chosen only since this matches the Walmart example above), exactly how many fast-food consumers would balk at the minor increase in prices and decide that they no longer wanted to heed their unhealthy cravings? Probably very few, judging by the looks of the general population. : )


Xenophon wrote:You raise a good point though that many small businesses do struggle to pay what their employees are "worth". I'll note anecdotally that most small to mid-size businesses acknowledge that and try to find other perks to offer, also most people that work for them understand that and do so for other reasons.

Worst case scenario, they could always socialize their debts by declaring bankruptcy. Our esteemed President has used this strategy on 6 occasions to restructure or write off billions of dollars worth of debt that he freely accumulated, while still retaining a significant personal fortune afterwards. Hooray for debt socialization!


Xenophon wrote:There is a reason that some countries are experimenting with basic income stipends and I think that is one solution. I'm probably more in favor of tax breaks filling the gap, but I'm willing to change my mind on that. Frankly, whether business pay enough or not aside, we will need to figure out a basic income strategy that accounts for automation I don't think we have many lawmakers that it has even crossed their minds.

You're right about this; things are going to get interesting as increased automation takes more human bodies out of the employment picture. Even McDonalds is experimenting with automated order kiosks so that they can study how the results will enable traditional hiring requirements to detach from store deployment in the future.
_moksha
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _moksha »

Maxine Waters wrote:I still think fewer people on food stamps is a win for everyone.

Well, it certainly would help decrease the surplus population.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
_Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

moksha wrote:
Maxine Waters wrote:I still think fewer people on food stamps is a win for everyone.

Well, it certainly would help decrease the surplus population.


Aren't we overpopulated, anyway? It's not like Progressive types really care all that much about human lives anyway what with them being for elective abortion and suicide.

- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_honorentheos
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _honorentheos »

I tend to agree with this article from Forbes after the November jobs report came out last week -
https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnmauldi ... 68326232e4

The end captures what I think really should make us a bit more pessimistic about the ability of the modern American economy to provide jobs for everyone who wants one and speaks to Ajax's ignorantly linear view that wages should go up if it really is so hard for people to find work that would provide a living wage if people are willing to do that work -

The vast bulk of workers do not have pricing power.

The labor market has changed dramatically in the last 20 years, and every study I have read as I have researched the future of work suggests that employment is going to change even more drastically in the next 20 years.

If we have 20 million workers who presumably want to have jobs but suddenly find themselves without job opportunities because of automation and other forces, that is not an environment in which we are going to see wage inflation.

That is a situation in which workers will take whatever wages they can get. Think Greece.

Monetary growth is decelerating, too. The velocity of money continues to fall. Total consumer debt as a percentage of disposable income is the highest it has ever been – over 26%.

The savings rate has fallen to a 10-year low. Consumers are stretched, and there is just not the buying power—no matter how low interest rates are—to create the inflation that the Fed is so afraid of.

I could go on and on about the fragility of this economy, even though on the surface it seems to be the strongest it has been since the Great Recession.

Looking ahead, 2018 should be another year for growth. So I look around and ask, what could endanger that? I think the biggest risk is central bank policy error.

We are going into unknown territory. Beyond this point, there be dragons.


Here there be dragons, indeed.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa
_Always Changing
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _Always Changing »

Re: "Think Greece" I have an internet friend who is multilingual and competent in technology and the communications industry. He gave up and went to England. Is now working and apparently making good money.
Problems with auto-correct:
In Helaman 6:39, we see the Badmintons, so similar to Skousenite Mormons, taking over the government and abusing the rights of many.
_Chap
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _Chap »

canpakes wrote:Otherwise, isn't Walmart stealing from the larger community that is now expending tax dollars to provide SNAP assistance to Walmart employees that qualify for it based upon their fairly dismal wages?


Well yes, fairly obviously.

Walmart can hardly pretend that the money they pay to their lower-paid full-time employees is enough for them to live on in a manner that counts as minimally decent for hard-working people in 21st century America. And Walmart knows that this basic standard is an absolute necessity if their employees are to remain capable of turning up every day and putting in a good day's work.

So they know what their employees need in order to live as human beings and work as hard as Walmart needs. But they don't pay that. Why?

Because they know darn well that Majax's tax dollars will bridge the gap for them through programmes like SNAP. So they can get away with paying less!

Smart business move for Walmart. Not so good for Majax and the other taxpayers.

How do you feel about that, Majax? What needs to be done in this specific case?
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_moksha
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Re: Winning: Food Stamp program costs hit 7 year low

Post by _moksha »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:Aren't we overpopulated, anyway? It's not like Progressive types really care all that much about human lives anyway what with them being for elective abortion and suicide.

- Doc

Excellent point. Those "Progressive types" with their desire to force abortions on freedom-loving women, forcing us all to plead for our lives in front of death panels, and letting illegal immigrants receive government-sponsored suicide benefits. The time is ripe to build The Wall and throw all the food stamps over it so the freeloaders, Catholics, and Mennonites will jump over The Wall to obtain those stamps. They will be in for a rude surprise when they try to redeem their stamps in Nogales. We can give even bigger tax cuts to the most deserving 1% with the money saved.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
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