The Bell Curve

[_honorentheos]

It's amazing that Markk read the thread with the result being he arrived on eugenics being a good idea that he was coming up with all on his own.

It was a genuinely jaw-dropping moment for me in reading this board.

[_EAllusion]

It's literally an inference.

Lol.

What's wrong with you...?

- Doc

Where's the inference Doc? I supposed the true fact that poor nutrition negatively impacts height to illustrate a point in a simple thought experiment.

[_honorentheos]

Huh? Poor nutrition is a factor reduced height. I didn't infer that. I asserted it as a known fact. I was illustrating a point about what you can infer about between-group variance when you know a trait itself, like all traits, is a product of hereditary and environmental interactions. What I pointed out was that you can infer that a difference in height between groups must be the result of some level of hereditary or environment from merely knowing that fact.

It's literally an inference.

Lol.

What's wrong with you...?

- Doc

What EA is saying is the scientifically demonstrated effect of poor nutrition on height is an accepted fact not an inference. "Hey, Google!..."
https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... an-height/

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Speaking of Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=define% ... e&ie=UTF-8

in·fer
inˈfər/Submit
verb
deduce or conclude (information) from evidence and reasoning rather than from explicit statements.

"from these facts we can infer that crime has been increasing"

I'm mean, we're getting into bizarre levels of absurd posting now. If y'all want to die on this anthill be my guest.

- Doc

[_honorentheos]

Cam,

EA simply pointed out that if there are multiple variables that effect outcomes (in the case of the example, genetics and nutrition on height) then a person can't assume because two different groups have different average heights that one group that averages slightly shorter must be shorter because of genetics. It could be that they have less access to good nutrition than the group with slightly higher average heights which suppresses the potential genetically they would be taller on average if all else were equal. It's just another way of saying one shouldn't get caught up in the appearance of correlation.

So when you say, "You literally just made an inference that the environmental factor of poor nutrition results in shorter people." Or, I guess, "You literally just concluded from evidence and reasoning that the environmental factor of poor nutrition results in shorter people", then you're missing the point in the opposite direction from what EA was saying with the analogy but which would still apply if one takes you, well, literally. In other words, EA wasn't making a statement of fact about cause and effect. That was something you inferred, wrongly, from the analogy.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Ok, buddy.

- Doc

[_Markk]

I just started reading this thread, and find it interesting, and a lot to think about... thanks.

What if you made the same arguments with dogs and their respective breeds? Some breeds are just naturally “smarter” and have “higher dog IQ’s.”

Certain breeds are chosen for certain jobs, because of their intelligence, and you can find studies that rate breed intelligence. Each dog would have to be trained to achieve their potential, but certain breeds have the gene pool to build on, where others do not.

Yeah, that reasoning was used for a very long time and was ultimately was very influential on the ideology of Nazis. Though in fairness, I believe horse breeding was the preferred comparison rather than dog breeding. Since then, making analogies to animal breeding to justify racial castes on the basis of genetic intellectual superiority and inferiority hasn't quite been something you want to be caught saying anywhere.

(It's like you just independently had a eureka moment and discovered 19th and early 20th century eugenics. Congrats.)

Wow, still butt hurt?

It cracks me up how you just google crap and pretend you know what you are talking about.

Race and IQ is part of the bell curve discussion, I would just love to see your arguments applied to the rest of nature from a evolution standpoint.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

It cracks me up how you just google crap and pretend you know what you are talking about.

Did you infer that or is that just a known fact? ;)

- Doc

[_Markk]

It cracks me up how you just google crap and pretend you know what you are talking about.

Did you infer that or is that just a known fact? ;)

- Doc

It is a known fact.

It reminds me of DCP telling me the church has always taught that Joseph Smith had a gun smuggled in and shot people...his cf was ...



In 1875...CCA Christensen's moving panorama illustrating church history. One of the 23 scenes illustrates the martyrdom and actually shows the smoking gun in Joseph's hand (circa this date). This was a traveling show of huge painted canvases that would be displayed to LDS audiences.

He acted like he studied this when he was a kid growing up in the church and it was a smoking gun (pun intended) that the church taught it. Just like EA tries to play off he is Cliff.

[_EAllusion]

Wow, still butt hurt?

It cracks me up how you just google crap and pretend you know what you are talking about.

Race and IQ is part of the bell curve discussion, I would just love to see your arguments applied to the rest of nature from a evolution standpoint.

You think being aware of the history of eugenics is so obscure that making a basic reference to it is a sign of putting on airs?

I guess it's even better than that. You're aware of my majors were in biology and psych. It's that you think that eugenics, a major inspiration for the most significant historical events of the past 100 years, is so obscure that even someone with post-secondary education with a focus on biological psychology couldn't possibly know anything about it without googling your inspired analogy to dog-breeding and the genetics of human ability?

I suppose anyone who would accidentally reinvent eugenics in a message board post in 2018 is someone who would think that, but as an FYI, nothing I talked about should be news to a literate adult.

P.S. I have no idea what your last sentence - "sentence" - is attempting to say.