Trump's War on Children

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_honorentheos
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _honorentheos »

ajax18 wrote:
honorentheos wrote:So asylum seekers need not apply...unless they do so while hanging out somewhere else until given permission to enter the country huh?


Then why wouldn't every would be immigrant just say, "We're seeking asylum."


Again, there are laws regarding this. See here for example:
https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil. ... ted-states

Something I did not know was that a person HAS to be present in the US to apply for asylum. One could apply for refugee status from outside the US.

Each year the United States sets a numerical limit on how many refugees will be admitted for humanitarian reasons. To be admitted as refugees, individuals must be screened by multiple international and U.S. agencies and prove that they have a “well-founded fear of persecution based on race, religion, membership in a particular social group, political opinion, or national origin.” Asylum seekers are individuals already in the United States who fear returning to their home countries, and they must prove they meet the definition of a refugee.

Why Don't They Just Get In Line?
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
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_Hawkeye
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _Hawkeye »

DHS secretary rolls out preposterous new claim about child separation policy

Kirstjen Nielsen's Twitter rant directly contradicts other Trump administration officials, as well as her own past comments.

Kirstjen Nielsen, secretary of the Department of Homeland Security, directly contradicted her colleagues in a multi-tweet thread Sunday evening, claiming preposterously that the Trump administration had no child separation policy for families detained at the U.S. southern border.

“This misreporting by Members, press & advocacy groups must stop. It is irresponsible and unproductive,” Nielsen wrote, referring to multiple reports from several outlets detailing accounts of immigrants separated from their children after seeking asylum in the United States. “As I have said many times before, if you are seeking asylum for your family, there is no reason to break the law and illegally cross between ports of entry. You are not breaking the law by seeking asylum at a port of entry.”

(According to several reports, many refugees are in fact being turned away at border points of entry while attempting to claim asylum.)

She added, “For those seeking asylum at ports of entry, we have continued the policy from previous Administrations and will only separate if the child is in danger, there is no custodial relationship between ‘family’ members, or if the adult has broken a law. DHS takes very seriously its duty to protect minors in our temporary custody from gangs, traffickers, criminals and abuse. We do not have a policy of separating families at the border. Period.”

On Monday morning, speaking to the National Sheriffs’ Association in New Orleans, Nielsen doubled down, saying, “We will not apologize for doing our job. We have sworn to do this job. This administration has a simple message: if you cross the border illegally, we will prosecute you.”

Nielsen’s comments come only two days after the Associated Press obtained DHS figures showing that nearly 2,000 children had been separated from their parents by border officials during a six-week span between April 19 and May 31 this year. The family separations are part of a new “zero-tolerance” policy announced by Attorney General Jeff Sessions on April 6.

Nielsen herself actually announced the policy during a border tour on May 31, touting the practice of separating children from their families by claiming the United States was a “nation of immigrants but also a nation of laws.” In an interview with NPR earlier in the month, the secretary was even more explicit about the new family separation policy, stating bluntly,

…If you are single adult, if you are part of a family, if you are pregnant, if you have any other condition, you’re an adult and you break the law, we will refer you. Operationally what that means is we will have to separate your family. That’s no different than what we do every day in every part of the United States when an adult of a family commits a crime. If you as a parent break into a house, you will be incarcerated by police and thereby separated from your family. We’re doing the same thing at the border.


The secretary’s rant also flies in the face of statements from other Trump administration officials, all of whom have given varying confusing responses to questions about the policy.

In May, White House chief of staff John Kelly confirmed that such a policy did exist and was adamant that it would deter those without documentation seeking to enter the country.

“[This is] the name of the game to a large degree,” he said, speaking with NPR. “…I sympathize with [their] reason [for coming here]. But the laws are the laws. But a big name of the game is deterrence.”

Kelly stressed that the policy would be a “tough deterrent,” noting there would be a “much faster turnaround on asylum seekers.”

“The children will be taken care of — put into foster care or whatever,” he said, when asked if he believed that policy was “cruel” or inhumane. “But the big point is they elected to come illegally into the United States and this is a technique that no one hopes will be used extensively or for very long.”

And as recently as this past weekend, the White House itself was actively defending the family separation policy. According to President Trump’s senior policy adviser, Stephen Miller — an unabashed supporter of the idea — the decision to implement family separation was “simple.”

“No nation can have the policy that whole classes of people are immune from immigration law or enforcement,” he told The New York Times. “It was a simple decision by the administration to have a zero tolerance policy for illegal entry, period. The message is that no one is exempt from immigration law.”

Both Trump and Sessions have given their own excuses for the policy, the latter using a Bible passage to defend it and appearing to suggest God supported such a decision, the Washington Post reported.

“I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13, to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained the government for his purposes,” Sessions said, speaking to a crowd of law enforcement officers in Indiana on Thursday. “Orderly and lawful processes are good in themselves. Consistent and fair application of the law is in itself a good and moral thing, and that protects the weak and protects the lawful.”

Experts have since pointed out that the scripture passage to which Sessions referred has been used in the past to justify such things as slavery and the Holocaust.

Trump, meanwhile, has rolled out his own excuse in the wake of the backlash to the family separation policy, one that’s been picked up and circulated by Republican Party leaders: Democrats made him do it.

“I hate the children being taken away. The Democrats have to change their law — that’s their law,” he said, speaking with reporters on Friday.

The president has tweeted similar comments on multiple occasions, including Monday, when he accused Democrats once more and claimed they weren’t as upset about gang violence as they were about child separations.

“Why don’t the Democrats give us the votes to fix the world’s worst immigration laws?” he wrote. “Where is the outcry for the killings and crime being caused by gangs and thugs, including MS-13, coming into our country illegally?”

In a follow-up tweet, he added, “CHANGE THE LAWS!

As many have noted, there is no law in place that requires the administration to separate families at the border.
_Jersey Girl
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _Jersey Girl »

Quasimodo wrote:
Jersey Girl wrote:I freaking give up.

No, actually I don't.


Good Jersey! Now is not the time to give up. Now is the time to fight back. It's gone too far.

I know it's not generally good to reference the Nazi regime generally, but I can't help seeing some similarities here. If it were 1936 and we had some chance to effect a change to that horrible outcome, shouldn't we have done that? I think that is where we are now. If we don't fight it now, it will only get worse.


Now, Quasi. Over 30 years as a child advocate. What do you think the chances are that I'd side with those playing sleight of hand with the truth regarding children? If you said, "No chance in hell at all", then you know who I really am.

I stand with the children.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
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_Quasimodo
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _Quasimodo »

Jersey Girl wrote:
Quasimodo wrote:Good Jersey! Now is not the time to give up. Now is the time to fight back. It's gone too far.

I know it's not generally good to reference the Nazi regime generally, but I can't help seeing some similarities here. If it were 1936 and we had some chance to effect a change to that horrible outcome, shouldn't we have done that? I think that is where we are now. If we don't fight it now, it will only get worse.


Now, Quasi. Over 30 years as a child advocate. What do you think the chances are that I'd side with those playing sleight of hand with the truth regarding children? If you said, "No chance in hell at all", then you know who I really am.

I stand with the children.


Yep. No chance in hell. :biggrin:
This, or any other post that I have made or will make in the future, is strictly my own opinion and consequently of little or no value.

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_Jersey Girl
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _Jersey Girl »

Petitions

https://action.aclu.org/petition/separating-families


https://www.change.org/p/keep-them-toge ... u-s-border


There are several online petitions available. I chose these.


Write or call your reps. Flood them with emails and voicemails!
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
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_MeDotOrg
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _MeDotOrg »

I don't know if this is the absolute worst behavior of the Trump Administration, but I can't think of anything to top it.

Why sends my blood pressure skyrocketing is when they say that the policy which the Trump Administration chose to implement, is the fault of the Democrats. Trump actually suggests that Democrats are to blame because they haven't funded the border wall. This is like a teenager telling his parents that he had to rob the liquor store because mom and dad wouldn't buy him a Porsche.

There are no kind words for this. There is no cause and effect between the Democrats and the actions of the Trump administration. The administration simply lies. The President's advisor Stephen Miller, sums up the administration's position:

No nation can have the policy that whole classes of people are immune from immigration law or enforcement. “It was a simple decision by the administration to have a zero tolerance policy for illegal entry, period. The message is that no one is exempt from immigration law.

Sorry, kids, but being compassionate and humane to whole classes of people just sends the wrong message. Next time pick better parents, like Barron did.

DHS Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen (finally an immigrant from a country Trump likes!) explained the situation like this:
We do not have a policy of separating families at the border. Period.

So it is a policy that is not a policy? How much more Orwellian than Newspeak is Trumpspeak?

You can call it whatever you want, but the policy of separating children from their parents at the border is a moral stain upon this country. If there is one gratifying element in any of this, it is that there is finally a rift between Trump and at least some of his supporters. A lot of religious figures (including Franklin Graham) are finally saying "enough!".

Jeff Sessions says the law is the law. But Jesus said, "Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven." But Jesus, do we really need Jesus to tell us this is wrong?

You have crossed the effing Rubicon, Donald Trump.
Last edited by Guest on Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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_canpakes
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _canpakes »

MeDotOrg wrote: ... there is finally a rift between Trump and at least some of his supporters. A lot of religious figures (including Franklin Graham) are finally saying "enough!".

Unfortunately, for most of these supporters, saying "enough!" is as far as they dare go, as opposed to voting "enough!”.

And that won’t be ‘enough’.
_Jersey Girl
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _Jersey Girl »

If anyone would like to incorporate scripture into correspondence to state representatives and are unfamiliar with scripture, here you go. If Sessions want's to play scripture lessons. I say we play with him.

These are all KJV

ETA: Recall that Sessions used Romans 13 to reinforce obedience to the government. Maybe he needs a reminder to obey his God. Just a suggestion...


From Leviticus 19 Sojourner Law

33 And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not vex him.

34 But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.


35 Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment, in meteyard, in weight, or in measure.
36 Just balances, just weights, a just ephah, and a just hin, shall ye have: I am the Lord your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt.

37 Therefore shall ye observe all my statutes, and all my judgments, and do them: I am the Lord.


From Matthew 25

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?

38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

9 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.


From Matthew 18

18 At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?

2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,

3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

5 And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me.

6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Last edited by Google Feedfetcher on Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:26 am, edited 2 times in total.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
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_MeDotOrg
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _MeDotOrg »

canpakes wrote:
MeDotOrg wrote: ... there is finally a rift between Trump and at least some of his supporters. A lot of religious figures (including Franklin Graham) are finally saying "enough!".

Unfortunately, for most of these supporters, saying "enough!" is as far as they dare go, as opposed to voting "enough!”.

And that won’t be ‘enough’.

When Trump said of John McCain "I like guys that don't get caught", I thought he had torpedoed his campaign. So you could very well be right. I keep think we have found the moral bottom. This afternoon I tried comforting myself by say "This isn't the country where I grew up", but then remembered the Japanese relocation centers in World War II, so it is exactly the country I where I grew up.
"The great problem of any civilization is how to rejuvenate itself without rebarbarization."
- Will Durant
"We've kept more promises than we've even made"
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_moksha
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Re: Trump's War on Children

Post by _moksha »

Ann Coulter says those terrified children in news reports were actors hired by liberals. Probably hired from Munchkins-R-Us.
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