Extreme Right Wing outlets like Heritage, Townhall? Not exactly sources of top notch research and objective scholarship. We've already been through this. The non-partisan Tax Policy Center Trump's them every time. These same idiots brought up the AMT a couple of years ago to prove taxes would go up but then Obama immediately extended it as expected. Their predictions are always way off and they are always designed to come up with conclusions to suit the Right Wing agenda. Remember all the hyperinflation? Oh wait, that never happened.
And there is no evidence that Obama went on an apology tour "apologizing for American values." Anyone who insists on this nonsense without providing evidence, has no business pretending to have credibility. Your long winded rant provided not a shred of evidence, but this is pretty much what we've come to expect from you. Now, tell us again how John Gee's impeccable scholars refutes all non-LDS scholarship on the Book of Abraham!
Obama fails his first serious interview
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_Kevin Graham
- _Emeritus
- Posts: 13037
- Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:44 pm
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_krose
- _Emeritus
- Posts: 2555
- Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:18 pm
Re: Obama fails his first serious interview
I'm sure the transcripts of all the president's speeches are available. It shouldn't be too hard to point out the "apologies."
Quotes please.
Quotes please.
"The DNA of fictional populations appears to be the most susceptible to extinction." - Simon Southerton
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_mledbetter
- _Emeritus
- Posts: 280
- Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 4:49 am
Re: Obama fails his first serious interview
Hey Kevin,
How is your family? I hope they are well.
Sorry for the late response. I’ve been…..busy. I wish I could get sleep these days. I really miss it. Actually, my wife has it worse, so I can’t complain.
====No, they (taxes) won't go up.
The ACA includes $60 billion new tax on the health care industry. Do you think that will be passed onto the middle class? I’ve already seen my health insurance premiums more than double (I'm sure in preparation for increased costs). I would argue that this is indeed a hidden tax on the middle class. Also, the individual mandate will hit lower income and young students the hardest. Democrats can deny this is a tax all they want, but the Supreme Court says otherwise.
====That''s exactly what I'm saying. It is one of the well refuted points of this election season, and Romney's latest accusation regarding Libya is no exception.
I have no problem with you including Politifact reports. They seem pretty down the middle, actually.
Like when they stated that Obama and the democrats lied about the Ryan plan. Making wild claims that the Ryan plan would destroy Medicare and push granny in a wheelchair off of a cliff.
FactCheck.org, on the other hand, is funded by the ANNENBERG Public Policy Center, and receives its funding out of the same money raised by Bill Ayers (you know that communist/terrorist who was Obama’s mentor) to create the Chicago ANNENBERG Challenge in which Barack Obama was the founding Chairman of the Board and Ayers served as the grant writer and co-chair for its two operating arms. We’ll ignore the fact that Obama lied about the nature of his relationship to a known terrorist because I honestly don’t want to go down the “which one lies the most” path. They both lie, because that’s what politicians do. I’m not arguing that Romney hasn’t lied. I have a problem, however, with the left making one excuse after another for this current President and completely ignoring his own lies.
Also, I think it’s a bit unfair for people on the left to say conservatives can’t quote right-leaning news sources while they are quoting sites like FactCheck.org, the HuffingtonPost and Media Matters.
=====I thought we were talking about apologizing, not showing respect in a traditional manner. Trust me, the Muslims think their leaders shaking hands with an infidel President is far more submissive than any kind of bowing our Presidents have engaged in. And yes, this is standard protocol in dipolmacy. Bush and Nixon are both caught on camera bowing before other world leaders. Bush even gave a Saudi Prince a kiss! Funny how the Right Wingers didn't pitch a fit about that.
In Asian cultures two people bow to each other out of mutual respect. It’s a custom of equals. The same as giving a kiss in certain Middle Eastern and Slavic countries. When I was in Slovenia, people kissed each other on both cheeks, sometimes. I found it an odd custom, but it’s a token of friendship. I have a huge problem with the President of the United States bowing to a dictator or King. It goes against everything we stand for. We should bow to no one, and should expect that nobody ever bows to us, either, in a manner that makes them or ourselves less equal. It was a huge sign of weakness to our soldiers serving in the Middle East and to other nations.
Also, you can look up his speeches in Cairo in 2009 and throughout his trip to Europe in which Obama apologized for “America’s past arrogances” and for the tortures that took place in Guantanamo bay while promising to have it closed down by mid to late 2009. Has that happened yet? Does that make the president a liar? I think so. If you make promises that you can’t keep, that makes you a liar. by the way, it’s also interesting that while he’s going around spiking the football on the killing of Osama, he fails to mention that it was through waterboarding that key intelligence was gained that lead to the killing of Osama Bin Laden. He also fails to give credit to the past administration that started the operational ball rolling that continued through his presidency and led to the death of Osama. Does that make Obama a hypocrite? I believe that it does. I believe that makes the guy look pretty slimy.
=====That's what Romney said and it sent off a firestorm of criticism from pundits on both sides of the fence because Obama did exactly what Romney said he didn't do.
You are absolutely correct on this point. I went back and studied the timeline and I have to admit that Romney really stepped in it on this one. I can’t defend him on it so I won’t try. It’s a bit disappointing too that he’s sticking to this statement, even after being presented the facts. He would look less like a liar and more like he just made a stupid mistake if he backed off his original comments after he had all of the facts.
=====But none of this is true, and it comes straight from the script provided by drudge, brietbart, FOX and a number of other credibility-free outlets. The only source used by the Right Wing media, to accuse the Obama administration of willfully ignoring actionable intelligence, was an anonymous source mentioned in some UK publication. But everyone involved has rejected any of this, including Republican chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.
Again, are you quoting Media Matters? Aren’t they funded by George Soros? (the epitome of evil, internationalist, radical, leftwing oligarch if there’s ever been one) It’s unfair of you to deny conservative media voices and say that only left leaning sources are fair resources. Whether they are credible sources of journalism and scholarship is a matter of opinion and very subjective.
The Independent, a newspaper in the UK, quoted unidentified senior diplomatic sources working in the U.S. government that American missions would be targeted. The Obama administration is denying this. Who is telling the truth? Also, I find it strange that this administration made the same mistakes that his predecessor made in that he ordered our military to drop bombs on a country, but left them on their own to do the cleanup. The Independent also quoted several unidentified intelligence sources stating their absolute frustration with how this administration has handled the entire situation in Libya since the war ended. Again, who is telling the truth? I think, at this point, it’s hard to claim that anyone here has a monopoly on the facts with regards to this situation.
=====That's a straw man. No one ever said, especially Obama, that he was going to "heal" relations to the point where a billion Muslims can be expected to cease from all violence when provoked in the worst way.
No, but he made a lot of ridiculous promises.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0tuAJkbUWU
It would seem to me that relations would at least be getting better by now. Can anyone really say that they are? Are we still in Iraq? I know the troop levels are now down to pre-surge levels. I won’t go into Obama’s criticisms of Bush when he was beginning the surge. Let’s just say that Obama turned out to be flat out wrong, but now he can go ahead and take credit for the surge’s success, just like he’s going around spiking the football on the Osama death.
Again, I’m not saying that Romney is anymore squeaky clean that Obama. However, Obama has had a chance. He had two years of complete control and passed huge spending and regulatory measures that have done nothing but make businesses nervous. After 2010, he has failed to work effectively with a majority Republican House. I have a little bit more faith in Romney simply for the fact that he was a very successful governor of a very large and wealthy state. He also had to work with a majority opposition legislature and was able to be successful at it. Now, he’s beat over the head with those successes (on both sides of the isle) as being a flip-flopper. Two of the most successful presidents in my lifetime where Reagan and (as much as a hate admitting it, but have grown wiser in my older years) Clinton. Both had to work with majority opposition control of congress. Both were able to do so, but it required give and take. At times, this would piss off their respective bases, but that’s what you have to do in a Democracy/Republic.
That being said, I’m not terrified of an Obama win in Nov. Maybe his winning will finally force both sides to start working together and make the concessions necessary to get our country back on track. I’m going to try to be open-minded and continue with my “wait and see” attitude on this.
How is your family? I hope they are well.
Sorry for the late response. I’ve been…..busy. I wish I could get sleep these days. I really miss it. Actually, my wife has it worse, so I can’t complain.
====No, they (taxes) won't go up.
The ACA includes $60 billion new tax on the health care industry. Do you think that will be passed onto the middle class? I’ve already seen my health insurance premiums more than double (I'm sure in preparation for increased costs). I would argue that this is indeed a hidden tax on the middle class. Also, the individual mandate will hit lower income and young students the hardest. Democrats can deny this is a tax all they want, but the Supreme Court says otherwise.
====That''s exactly what I'm saying. It is one of the well refuted points of this election season, and Romney's latest accusation regarding Libya is no exception.
I have no problem with you including Politifact reports. They seem pretty down the middle, actually.
Like when they stated that Obama and the democrats lied about the Ryan plan. Making wild claims that the Ryan plan would destroy Medicare and push granny in a wheelchair off of a cliff.
FactCheck.org, on the other hand, is funded by the ANNENBERG Public Policy Center, and receives its funding out of the same money raised by Bill Ayers (you know that communist/terrorist who was Obama’s mentor) to create the Chicago ANNENBERG Challenge in which Barack Obama was the founding Chairman of the Board and Ayers served as the grant writer and co-chair for its two operating arms. We’ll ignore the fact that Obama lied about the nature of his relationship to a known terrorist because I honestly don’t want to go down the “which one lies the most” path. They both lie, because that’s what politicians do. I’m not arguing that Romney hasn’t lied. I have a problem, however, with the left making one excuse after another for this current President and completely ignoring his own lies.
Also, I think it’s a bit unfair for people on the left to say conservatives can’t quote right-leaning news sources while they are quoting sites like FactCheck.org, the HuffingtonPost and Media Matters.
=====I thought we were talking about apologizing, not showing respect in a traditional manner. Trust me, the Muslims think their leaders shaking hands with an infidel President is far more submissive than any kind of bowing our Presidents have engaged in. And yes, this is standard protocol in dipolmacy. Bush and Nixon are both caught on camera bowing before other world leaders. Bush even gave a Saudi Prince a kiss! Funny how the Right Wingers didn't pitch a fit about that.
In Asian cultures two people bow to each other out of mutual respect. It’s a custom of equals. The same as giving a kiss in certain Middle Eastern and Slavic countries. When I was in Slovenia, people kissed each other on both cheeks, sometimes. I found it an odd custom, but it’s a token of friendship. I have a huge problem with the President of the United States bowing to a dictator or King. It goes against everything we stand for. We should bow to no one, and should expect that nobody ever bows to us, either, in a manner that makes them or ourselves less equal. It was a huge sign of weakness to our soldiers serving in the Middle East and to other nations.
Also, you can look up his speeches in Cairo in 2009 and throughout his trip to Europe in which Obama apologized for “America’s past arrogances” and for the tortures that took place in Guantanamo bay while promising to have it closed down by mid to late 2009. Has that happened yet? Does that make the president a liar? I think so. If you make promises that you can’t keep, that makes you a liar. by the way, it’s also interesting that while he’s going around spiking the football on the killing of Osama, he fails to mention that it was through waterboarding that key intelligence was gained that lead to the killing of Osama Bin Laden. He also fails to give credit to the past administration that started the operational ball rolling that continued through his presidency and led to the death of Osama. Does that make Obama a hypocrite? I believe that it does. I believe that makes the guy look pretty slimy.
=====That's what Romney said and it sent off a firestorm of criticism from pundits on both sides of the fence because Obama did exactly what Romney said he didn't do.
You are absolutely correct on this point. I went back and studied the timeline and I have to admit that Romney really stepped in it on this one. I can’t defend him on it so I won’t try. It’s a bit disappointing too that he’s sticking to this statement, even after being presented the facts. He would look less like a liar and more like he just made a stupid mistake if he backed off his original comments after he had all of the facts.
=====But none of this is true, and it comes straight from the script provided by drudge, brietbart, FOX and a number of other credibility-free outlets. The only source used by the Right Wing media, to accuse the Obama administration of willfully ignoring actionable intelligence, was an anonymous source mentioned in some UK publication. But everyone involved has rejected any of this, including Republican chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.
Again, are you quoting Media Matters? Aren’t they funded by George Soros? (the epitome of evil, internationalist, radical, leftwing oligarch if there’s ever been one) It’s unfair of you to deny conservative media voices and say that only left leaning sources are fair resources. Whether they are credible sources of journalism and scholarship is a matter of opinion and very subjective.
The Independent, a newspaper in the UK, quoted unidentified senior diplomatic sources working in the U.S. government that American missions would be targeted. The Obama administration is denying this. Who is telling the truth? Also, I find it strange that this administration made the same mistakes that his predecessor made in that he ordered our military to drop bombs on a country, but left them on their own to do the cleanup. The Independent also quoted several unidentified intelligence sources stating their absolute frustration with how this administration has handled the entire situation in Libya since the war ended. Again, who is telling the truth? I think, at this point, it’s hard to claim that anyone here has a monopoly on the facts with regards to this situation.
=====That's a straw man. No one ever said, especially Obama, that he was going to "heal" relations to the point where a billion Muslims can be expected to cease from all violence when provoked in the worst way.
No, but he made a lot of ridiculous promises.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0tuAJkbUWU
It would seem to me that relations would at least be getting better by now. Can anyone really say that they are? Are we still in Iraq? I know the troop levels are now down to pre-surge levels. I won’t go into Obama’s criticisms of Bush when he was beginning the surge. Let’s just say that Obama turned out to be flat out wrong, but now he can go ahead and take credit for the surge’s success, just like he’s going around spiking the football on the Osama death.
Again, I’m not saying that Romney is anymore squeaky clean that Obama. However, Obama has had a chance. He had two years of complete control and passed huge spending and regulatory measures that have done nothing but make businesses nervous. After 2010, he has failed to work effectively with a majority Republican House. I have a little bit more faith in Romney simply for the fact that he was a very successful governor of a very large and wealthy state. He also had to work with a majority opposition legislature and was able to be successful at it. Now, he’s beat over the head with those successes (on both sides of the isle) as being a flip-flopper. Two of the most successful presidents in my lifetime where Reagan and (as much as a hate admitting it, but have grown wiser in my older years) Clinton. Both had to work with majority opposition control of congress. Both were able to do so, but it required give and take. At times, this would piss off their respective bases, but that’s what you have to do in a Democracy/Republic.
That being said, I’m not terrified of an Obama win in Nov. Maybe his winning will finally force both sides to start working together and make the concessions necessary to get our country back on track. I’m going to try to be open-minded and continue with my “wait and see” attitude on this.
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