Trump Disrespects Military... again

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

I think it's a pretty worrisome thing to call military types heroes simply because they elect to do what they do, however daunting, however demanding, and however consuming their service is. Every profession attracts a huge swath of personalities, and while the argument can be made that the military attracts psychopaths, I'd suggest the military is just a reflection of the society it's sworn to defend, whatever that means.

One could argue that the teaching profession attracts a higher percentage of psychopaths given the amount of student-fucking that goes on, the backstabbing that takes place, and the level of gamesmanship that occurs within the profession. That said, I'd argue if we're going to assign hero status to a profession teachers are much more deserving of the title given their dedication to their craft, the many examples of daily selflessness, and the huge rations of BS they get to eat simply because they want to educate current and future generations of citizens.

Whatever the case may be, to have a Commander in Chief crap all over a man who is arguable at the pinnacle of his profession, has a history of service that is virtually unparalleled, and to cavalierly disregard the military as its Commander is insanity. It's utter garbage. I have no idea what it's going to take for the Conservative military-Thankyouforyourservice types to snap out of their collective delusion about this man, and, quite frankly, their odd fascination with backpatting military types. I'd much prefer they save their backpatting for emergency personnel, teachers, service providers, and everyone that makes a genuine day-to-day quality of life difference to them.

- Doc

[_canpakes]

Why doen’t Trump dare to visit our servicemen and women overseas?

”He’s never been interested in going,” the official said of Trump visiting troops in a combat zone, citing conversations with the president. “He’s afraid of those situations. He’s afraid people want to kill him.”

Pressure for Trump to make such a visit has been building for months. Eliot Cohen, a former George W. Bush administration official and Trump critic, has raised the issue regularly in public.

“The point is American servicemen and women are on the ground in these places,” Cohen said in an interview. “They are getting killed. I think any good leader would want to see something for themselves. And they would want to do something for the troops other than using them as props.”

[_Chap]

Trump reportedly ‘afraid’ to visit troops in combat zone

Thinking about the bone spurs that kept him out of Vietnam, it figures.

It was the Associated Press that first broached the topic with Donald Trump last month, asking the president why he hadn’t yet visited a military base in a combat zone like in Iraq and Afghanistan. Trump replied that he’d do so eventually, though he didn’t see it as “overly necessary.”

He added in the same interview, “I’ve been very busy with everything that’s taking place here…. I’m doing a lot of things. I’m doing a lot of things.”

The New York Times reported soon after on another possible explanation: “One reason he has not visited troops in war zones, according to his aides, is that he does not really want American troops there in the first place. To visit, they said, would validate missions he does not truly believe in.”

When Fox News’ Chris Wallace asked the president about this the other day, Trump replied, “I’ve had an unbelievably busy schedule, on top of which you have these phony witch hunts.”

Putting aside the fact that the president’s schedule really isn’t “unbelievably busy” – he’s had plenty of time for golf and excessive television watching – are we really supposed to believe Trump hasn’t traveled to a military base in a combat zone because of Special Counsel Robert Mueller and the investigation into the Russia scandal?

The Washington Post has now reported on a brand new explanation.

Trump has spoken privately about his fears over risks to his own life, according to a former senior White House official, who has discussed the issue with the president and spoke on the condition of anonymity to speak candidly about Trump’s concerns.

“He’s never been interested in going,” the official said of Trump visiting troops in a combat zone, citing conversations with the president. “He’s afraid of those situations. He’s afraid people want to kill him.”

For what it’s worth, I’ve never worn the uniform, but I suspect plenty of servicemen and women stationed abroad worry about people wanting to kill them, too.

They’re there anyway.

Given the attention this issue is starting to receive, it’s likely that Trump really will make a trip along these lines sometime soon, if only to avoid further embarrassment.

That said, the Washington Post’s article added, “Current advisers said Trump is not expected to visit a war zone during the Thanksgiving break, which he will spend at his Mar-a-Lago golf resort in Florida"

[_Kevin Graham]

I think it's a pretty worrisome thing to call military types heroes simply because they elect to do what they do, however daunting, however demanding, and however consuming their service is. Every profession attracts a huge swath of personalities, and while the argument can be made that the military attracts psychopaths, I'd suggest the military is just a reflection of the society it's sworn to defend, whatever that means.

One could argue that the teaching profession attracts a higher percentage of psychopaths given the amount of ____ that goes on, the backstabbing that takes place, and the level of gamesmanship that occurs within the profession. That said, I'd argue if we're going to assign hero status to a profession teachers are much more deserving of the title given their dedication to their craft, the many examples of daily selflessness, and the huge rations of ____ they get to eat simply because they want to educate current and future generations of citizens.

Whatever the case may be, to have a Commander in Chief crap all over a man who is arguable at the pinnacle of his profession, has a history of service that is virtually unparalleled, and to cavalierly disregard the military as its Commander is insanity. It's utter garbage. I have no idea what it's going to take for the Conservative military-Thankyouforyourservice types to snap out of their collective delusion about this man, and, quite frankly, their odd fascination with backpatting military types. I'd much prefer they save their backpatting for emergency personnel, teachers, service providers, and everyone that makes a genuine day-to-day quality of life difference to them.

- Doc

Last night I watched Buffalo Soldiers, and was blown away by how much it reflected the reality I experienced growing up on military bases.

[Guest]

Go to a gathering of Republicans and suggest that the US military attracts psychopaths who get off on authority and hurting people and shouldn't be thought of heroes merely because of their service. This is objectively true, mind you.

Come on, EA. I have great respect for your general credibility, outlook, posts and contributions to the board, but you need to re-think this one. People join the military for any number of reasons.

For me, and many of my generation, it was the draft. You could either join up and have some choice as to your Service and MOS, or you could wait to be drafted and take what was offered (which was generally a uniform and a rifle). I joined up so as not to be drafted. Otherwise I would have never considered the military, in the same way I would have never considered an LDS mission.

Are there individuals in the volunteer military who are psychopaths?

Certainly. I don't believe that I have ever met one, however. The military into which I enlisted was populated with young kids, most of whom did not wish to be there, and too many of whom never made it home.

Perhaps if some of them would have acted more like psychopathic killers while in theater their chances of coming home alive would have been a bit better

The ex-military colleagues and acquaintances I have nowadays are former officers, among them at least one general rank officer from each of the Army, Navy and Air Force. One of them is the former SACEUR and commander of NATO forces.

I have great respect for all of these men. Among them they have done and accomplished things that must of us could not even imagine.

None of them have lived lives that would indicate any psychopathic tendencies. These men come across as wise, calm, personable and stable individuals. A common attitude among them is that a good day is any day no one is shooting at you.

I agree with your statements about how Trump treats the military, and about what would happen when one who is not Trump disrespects the military to conservatives. However, you leave the impression that the military is loaded with psychopaths who joined to kill.

This is irresponsible and damages your credibility. If you are going to make such statements on a forum like this, then you need to cite a source and provide some numbers. How "bad" do you think it is?

Assuming that 1% of the general male population are psychopaths and that 25% of the male prison population are psychopaths, what do you think the percentage is in the military?

Is the percentage different among the services?

Is the percentage for enlisted different that for officers?

If you have looked at the literature you would have noted that antisocial personality disorder (ASPD) is a term now recognized and used by the military. This designation may include folks who would be rated as either sociopaths or psychopaths on the couch. ASPD is found in an estimated 4% of the general population.

You would have seen that such individuals who do join the military tend to gravitate to infantry or armor. These individuals, who also have the required physical attributes, and are not so severely affected that they cannot be trained, are highly prized by infantry and special forces unit commanders. Chris Kyle (the American Sniper) was likely an example.

Finally, please think about how fortunate you and I are that we have a few good "natural born killers" in the service of our country.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

When one scratches just below the surface, quite often what a person is telling others is just a warning about themselves.

- Doc

[_Morley]

Go to a gathering of Republicans and suggest that the US military attracts psychopaths who get off on authority and hurting people and shouldn't be thought of heroes merely because of their service. This is objectively true, mind you.

my bold


That you believe this is incredible.

[_Morley]

Go to a gathering of Republicans and suggest that the US military attracts psychopaths who get off on authority and hurting people and shouldn't be thought of heroes merely because of their service. This is objectively true, mind you.

my bold

That you believe this is incredible.

and deplorable.

[_SteelHead]

MY opinion and observation. Psychopaths around the military tend to be those who profit off of the industrial military complex and who use the sacrifice of young people to enrich their pockets caring nothing about human lives, but rather focused on riches and power (so both industrialists and politicians). The military folk I know are generally great people. Some of them lean pretty far to the nationlisitic side of patriotism, but I think that might be part of what draws many to military service.

[_Morley]

Go to a gathering of Republicans and suggest that the US military attracts psychopaths who get off on authority and hurting people and shouldn't be thought of heroes merely because of their service. This is objectively true, mind you.

Come on, EA. I have great respect for your general credibility, outlook, posts and contributions to the board, but you need to re-think this one. People join the military for any number of reasons.
. . .

This is irresponsible and damages your credibility. If you are going to make such statements on a forum like this, then you need to cite a source and provide some numbers. How "bad" do you think it is?

Nice post, DrW.