Bummer Summer Jobs Disaster

[Alf'Omega]

Many of them were "smart/unethical" enough to find ways of double and triple dipping. Many get military disability checks, civilian disability checks, and even work a job.

Take a lawyer I knew back in NOLA. He was 52 and recently diagnosed with diabetes. He wasn't even insulin dependent. But it was enough to convince a judge he deserved $150k/year in own occupational disability. What people don't realize is that the taxpayer pays the first $1500 of this every month in social security tax. So what does he do with his time? He's playing in 4 tennis leagues this season, remodeling his house, free to go on extended vacations. He's free to do whatever he wants with his time and he'll never have to work another day in his life. Tell me that kind of retirement isn't above and beyond what most people could ever earn for themselves just by saving money. Even refusing to marry and have kids wouldn't allow you to save that kind of money.

Ajax, it's impossible to evaluate your example without all the facts. I'd lay good odds that the lawyer was able to "convince a judge" with additional evidence. Unless you've got a copy of the judge's opinion, there's no way to evaluate the situation. For example, I also have diabetes. I don't have to take insulin (yet). What I do have his peripheral neuropathy. My feet are mostly numb, and my fingers started going numb last summer. If they get numb enough, I may no longer be able to keyboard. That's become an important skill in my line of work. Diabetes has all kinds of complications that can show up even though I don't need insulin (yet). Me, I'd rather work.

There will always be scammers who will prey on government programs and/or private companies. So, even if this lawyer guy has scammed the system, that doesn't mean we should abandon the system.

As for disability, one isn't either not disabled or totally disabled. Partial disability is an actual thing, even though a person may be able to work a job. It's an insurable risk, whether through the private market or government programs or both.

Finally, I certainly don't resent wounded veterans who are compensated for their disabilities. My father in law had his foot shot all to hell in Vietnam. I'm sure he was found at least partially disabled and was compensated for it. But it wasn't enough to raise his family on, so he worked. I'm not sure why you resent that.

Nuance is a nightmare for people like ajax, as it typically upends their entire worldview.

[ajax18]

Finally, I certainly don't resent wounded veterans who are compensated for their disabilities. My father in law had his foot shot all to hell in Vietnam. I'm sure he was found at least partially disabled and was compensated for it. But it wasn't enough to raise his family on, so he worked. I'm not sure why you resent that.

I've seen veterans living off $2k/month for post traumatic stress disorder. To me that's kind of weak. There are jobs they could still do.

As for disability, one isn't either not disabled or totally disabled. Partial disability is an actual thing, even though a person may be able to work a job. It's an insurable risk, whether through the private market or government programs or both.

If you're able to work a job, why are you eligible for disability?

Social Security is a lot different than having the choice to purchase long term care insurance, life insurance, or own occupational disability insurance. Number one the beneficiary has the choice to purchase the insurance or not. If an insurer gets a reputation for bad faith in paying claims, you can take your business elsewhere. When the government takes the money you paid in social security and gives it to people who in their opinion need it more than you, you have no choice but to keep paying or go to jail or leave the country. The insurer also has the choice to sell insurance or not based on his risk assessment.

Finally when someone makes a disability claim against an insurance company, the insurance company has lawyers to protect the insterests of the company and by extension other policy holders. When someone makes a claim against the government, there is nobody in court to speak up for the interests of the taxpayer. Hence no matter how outlandish the disability claim, be it alcoholism, back pain, dry eye, or whatever, it may take a while but eventually most of them get on it and <0.04% ever get off of it.

[Res Ipsa]

Finally, I certainly don't resent wounded veterans who are compensated for their disabilities. My father in law had his foot shot all to hell in Vietnam. I'm sure he was found at least partially disabled and was compensated for it. But it wasn't enough to raise his family on, so he worked. I'm not sure why you resent that.

I've seen veterans living off $2k/month for post traumatic stress disorder. To me that's kind of weak. There are jobs they could still do.

As for disability, one isn't either not disabled or totally disabled. Partial disability is an actual thing, even though a person may be able to work a job. It's an insurable risk, whether through the private market or government programs or both.

If you're able to work a job, why are you eligible for disability?

Social Security is a lot different than having the choice to purchase long term care insurance, life insurance, or own occupational disability insurance. Number one the beneficiary has the choice to purchase the insurance or not. If an insurer gets a reputation for bad faith in paying claims, you can take your business elsewhere. When the government takes the money you paid in social security and gives it to people who in their opinion need it more than you, you have no choice but to keep paying or go to jail or leave the country. The insurer also has the choice to sell insurance or not based on his risk assessment.

Finally when someone makes a disability claim against an insurance company, the insurance company has lawyers to protect the insterests of the company and by extension other policy holders. When someone makes a claim against the government, there is nobody in court to speak up for the interests of the taxpayer. Hence no matter how outlandish the disability claim, be it alcoholism, back pain, dry eye, or whatever, it may take a while but eventually most of them get on it and <0.04% ever get off of it.

Because the disability affects your earnings.

Unless you are qualified to assess disability, your opinion that PTSD can never be a total disability is just bias.

Do you have stats on the acceptance rates for disability claims? And if someone is permanently disabled, why would you expect them to magically become disbled?

You don't have any experience with disability claims, do you?

[Alf'Omega]

I suspect Ajax has tons of experience illicitly passing judgement on people based on incomplete information. Most bigotry is rooted in ignorance.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

I suspect Ajax has tons of experience illicitly passing judgement on people based on incomplete information. Most bigotry is rooted in ignorance.

It's just larping. He has no clue who does what.

[ajax18]

You don't have any experience with disability claims, do you?

This is what I think of disability. This article pretty well aligns with my views of the program and why even after 6 years the program is in sore need of reform.

https://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/

[Res Ipsa]

You don't have any experience with disability claims, do you?

This is what I think of disability. This article pretty well aligns with my views of the program and why even after 6 years the program is in sore need of reform.

https://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/

Thanks for the reference. I think the article makes a good case for reforming the system. There are some backwards incentives in there that need to be changed. I'm not opposed to making changes to fix problems in programs -- just the opposite.

But it seems to me that the article identifies this as the fundamental problem:

Somewhere around 30 years ago, the economy started changing in some fundamental ways. There are now millions of Americans who do not have the skills or education to make it in this country.

So what should we do about that? With increasing automation, this is a problem that will only worsen as time goes on. So, what should we do about it?

[ajax18]

We had a great thread about this on the old board back in 2014. We even resurrected it 2 years later. Cinepro had some good ideas.

[Res Ipsa]

We had a great thread about this on the old board back in 2014. We even resurrected it 2 years later. Cinepro had some good ideas.

I must have missed it. Or forgot it. Flip a coin.

The one thing I'm pretty sure of is the free market's solution: let people who can't work starve. The market doesn't care whether you or I live or die. It doesn't care whether jobs pay a living wage.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

You don't have any experience with disability claims, do you?

This is what I think of disability. This article pretty well aligns with my views of the program and why even after 6 years the program is in sore need of reform.

https://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/

I agree with Xanax for once. The system is being abused.

- Doc