A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

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_Bazooka
_Emeritus
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Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _Bazooka »

ldsfaqs wrote:As usual you people make things personal rather than dealing with the facts.

But, I'll entertain you more to further show your bigotry and elitism.

As most of you know, I was in the Marine Corps. I however did not serve a full term due to health reasons. Because of the nature of those reasons, and the situations resulting, I did not get an honorable discharge. I didn't do anything wrong, I simply had to leave, take a leave, and they wouldn't allow it. Thus, that resulted in not getting an honorable discharge. Not dishonorable, but not honorable either.

Anyway, I was a week away from starting the Police Academy. Had passed ALL tests, had my equipment, had taken 2 years of Criminal Justice, learned from prior officers, and even the Academy Director and some of the instructors, etc. I had been assured, and was friends with the Director himself that my military discharge wouldn't be a problem. Problem was, he missed a little detail. The agency that did the background check did so in a manner as if they were going to hire someone themselves. They had a strict pass/fail rule that if you were in the military, you HAD to have had an honorable discharge, period. So, at the last minute I found out my background check didn't go through because of that, and years of planning went down the toilet because it was then too late to have another agency that wasn't that strict do the check.

So, I had other options..... could have continued in another year or so, maybe with another program, but then a change came over me and I decided I simply didn't want the erratic schedual of most law enforcement, and instead wanted a 8-5 type career for family, Gospel, etc., and so I decided likely teaching, since that was my other passion. Anyway, here I am, not a teacher either because of a sad marriage and bad luck. That's another story.

by the way, because of growing up foster child and being involved in various government programs, schooling etc. I am perfectly psychologically normal. Been tested many times in all kinds of ways. Sorry to disappoint you.... I know you were hoping.

Oh, there is "one" difference though that has been found about me.
You know that test that determines (what was it?) the four different quadrants personality type someone is? Well, while I do have a "dominante" quadrant like everyone else, I'm different from everyone else in that while everyone else has a clear particular dominant quadrant or two, I'm actually almost fully EQUAL among all four quadrants. My dominante quadrant is only a couple of points higher than all the others, making all four almost exactly equal. In other words, I'm talented and use all parts of my brain, at least in reference to behavior patterns and talents. No, I don't have super powers.... haa haa :lol: Anyway, those kinds of results are very rare, that the person testing us had never seen it before (some psychology class or something I took once).....


You may be "perfectly psychologically normal" but your CV reads like a train crash.
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)
_subgenius
_Emeritus
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Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _subgenius »

Analytics wrote:A couple of points.

If your gun is stollen once or twice that's forgivable. But I'd have a three-strikes-and-you're out rule--getting your gun stollen three times proves either that you are lying about you guns being stollen or are incapable of preventing the murderer's tool of choice from falling into the hands of criminals. In either case, habitually loosing your guns proves you shouldn't have them.

unenforceable and ridiculous.
Should we close down convenience stores that get robbed more than once ,because obviously they are complicit in the crime?
http://tucker.patch.com/articles/tucker ... -this-week
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2013/0 ... story.html
your conclusion about what is "obvious" is fantasy.

Analytics wrote:Second, if you legally sold your gun under GORE, you would have your own documentation proving it. So in the extremely unlikely event that the government couldn't keep track of a simple transaction like this, you'd still be able to easily prove what really happened.

so as long as i had my own forged documentation, i would be ok - great!
though it is really no worry, when the govt intends on tracking they lose 70%...those are odds that only get better as the paperwork increases.

Analytics wrote:Third, the GORE law would replace the current hodge-podge of state-based laws with a federal law that makes sense, is simpler, and is easier to enforce. Currently, it’s totally legal to sell a gun to a felon for cash in a parking lot if you don’t happen to know he is a felon. And if you purchase a gun in a straw sale for a bad guy, the government must spy on you and see you give it to the bad guy and prove that that was your intention when you purchased it. Under GORE, the responsibilities of a gun owner is clear, and whether or not you are complying with those responsibilities is crystal clear.

pipe dream of nonsense.
Currently, every gun owner knows they are at risk if they sell a gun privately...which they should be allowed to do...a simple bill of sale of their own making is sufficient to remove that liability, there is no need to expand the incompetency of the government. Again, legitimate and honest people do not sell to criminals 99.9% of the time. Gun ownership is not a burden it is a freedom.
A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(d), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]

http://www.atf.gov/content/firearms-fre ... d-transfer

quit being a political stooge/chump on this issue. There is no rational basis for this level of federal intrusion.

Analytics wrote:This also protects responsible gun owners, by the way. Currently, if you sell a gun you have to make a judgment call about whether or not the person you are selling to is suspicious and whether you should notify the ATF of the sale, and you have to wonder if the government is spying on you and trying to read your mind about whether you know that the guy you are selling your guns to is a buyer for a Mexican drug cartel. Under GORE, if you verify the buyer’s identity and transfer ownership on the GORE.gov website, you can rest assured that the government isn’t spying on you and trying to build a case based on what they think your intentions are.

GORE isn't about more laws--it's about better laws.

your proposition is naïve and absurd...destined for impotence.

"No such rule or regulation prescribed [by the Attorney General] after the date of the enactment of the Firearms Owners Protection Act may require that records required to be maintained under this chapter or any portion of the contents of such records, be recorded at or transferred to a facility owned, managed, or controlled by the United States or any State or any political subdivision thereof, nor that any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions or disposition be established. Nothing in this section expands or restricts the Secretary's authority to inquire into the disposition of any firearm in the course of a criminal investigation." (emphasis mine)
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/926

in a nutshell (emphasis on nut), this is all you are proposing - that which is already being prohibited by law....there is no legitimate reason to expand the current system to legal weapons.
Legislation by fear is a horrible strategy.

Currently there are millions of weapons in the system of ATF, weapons being traced...and being traced poorly....as of 2010 there were about 4.2 million in this system...there an estimated 270 million firearms in America today....good luck with that.

Your plan is tantamount to those flat tax consumption tax people...which ultimately, by your logic, requires that taxes be collected at every yard sale.......some ideas are just bad, they have good intentions, but they are just fundamentally bad.... and GORE is one of them.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
_Doctor CamNC4Me
_Emeritus
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Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

Could the GORE Act have prevented this?

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nati ... 9825.story

- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_Analytics
_Emeritus
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Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _Analytics »

I'm now more convinced than ever that guns are flowing from the gun manufacturing industry to criminals, gangs, and drug cartels like water through a sieve, and that our current laws are ineffectual to stop it.

If our laws are going to allow people to own “tools” that are specifically designed to kill other human beings, then people who choose to own these tools must be held to exceptionally high levels of personal responsibility. This includes making the owners of these tools of murder personally accountable for ensuring that their tools don’t fall into the wrong hands.
It’s relatively easy to agree that only Homo sapiens can speak about things that don’t really exist, and believe six impossible things before breakfast. You could never convince a monkey to give you a banana by promising him limitless bananas after death in monkey heaven.

-Yuval Noah Harari
_Res Ipsa
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Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _Res Ipsa »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:Could the GORE Act have prevented this?

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nati ... 9825.story

- Doc


Laws against theft clearly don't prevent all theft. Should we repeal them?
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951
_Analytics
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Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _Analytics »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:Could the GORE Act have prevented this?

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nati ... 9825.story

- Doc

Yes--if GORE would have been implemented nation-wide 10 years ago, it would have been very difficult (read much more expensive) for these guys to get their hands on guns. If they wouldn't have had easy access to cheap weapons on a black market with an endless supply, the shooting wouldn't have happened.

If the gun manufacturs, dealers, and purchasers were held to high levels of personal responsibility and accountability, they would stop supplying the black market with weapons.
It’s relatively easy to agree that only Homo sapiens can speak about things that don’t really exist, and believe six impossible things before breakfast. You could never convince a monkey to give you a banana by promising him limitless bananas after death in monkey heaven.

-Yuval Noah Harari
_subgenius
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Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

Re: A Modest Proposal to Reduce Gun Violence

Post by _subgenius »

Analytics wrote:If the gun manufacturs, dealers, and purchasers were held to high levels of personal responsibility and accountability, they would stop supplying the black market with weapons.

dumbest logic ever.

"high levels"? you mean cumbersome and disarming levels....i can't imagine why you are so infatuated with putting on that leash and suckling for the teet of Obama.
GORE is an absolute horrible idea, again good intention, just horrible scheme.

personal responsibility is not something legislated....accountability comes from proper enforcement of laws already in existence...i can fathom why throwing more legalese at the problem is always the liberal response...oh wait....most of them are lawyers and its good for business.
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
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