DiscussMormonism.com

Res Ipsa wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 1:22 am

Moksha wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 12:54 am

Getting back to Lia Thomas, perhaps there could be a special category of trophy for transgender males, so biological females can still get their place at the podium.

Hey, Moksha. Just a note on terminology:

Cis=sex and gender match
Trans=sex and gender don’t match

I’m a cis man
Jersey girl is a cis woman
Lia is a trans woman
The other trans swimmer mentioned in the article is a trans man.

If you use the gendered terms as the person you’re talking about describes themselves, you’ll be using the terminology correctly.

You don’t believe biological women exist, just cis women?

Atlanticmike wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 3:56 pm

Res Ipsa wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 1:22 am

Hey, Moksha. Just a note on terminology:

Cis=sex and gender match
Trans=sex and gender don’t match

I’m a cis man
Jersey girl is a cis woman
Lia is a trans woman
The other trans swimmer mentioned in the article is a trans man.

If you use the gendered terms as the person you’re talking about describes themselves, you’ll be using the terminology correctly.

You don’t believe biological women exist, just cis women?

No, I don’t believe that “biological women” or “cis women” exist. Lia exists. The human mind has created many categories and labels we could apply to her. Those do not “exist” — at least not in the way Lia does.

None of these labels should be mistaken for Lia. None of them give a complete description of who she is. They are mental constructs that help our brains understand the world and that facilitate communication. But they can do the latter only if we assign the same meaning to the label.

So, my comment to Moksha has nothing to do with existence. It simply clarified how a specific label, “Transgender,” is used. What he did was a simple mistake, as if he had used the term “gay” to refer to a heterosexual relationship.

Res Ipsa wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 4:15 pm

Atlanticmike wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 3:56 pm

You don’t believe biological women exist, just cis women?

No, I don’t believe that “biological women” or “cis women” exist. Lia exists. The human mind has created many categories and labels we could apply to her. Those do not “exist” — at least not in the way Lia does.

None of these labels should be mistaken for Lia. None of them give a complete description of who she is. They are mental constructs that help our brains understand the world and that facilitate communication. But they can do the latter only if we assign the same meaning to the label.

So, my comment to Moksha has nothing to do with existence. It simply clarified how a specific label, “Transgender,” is used. What he did was a simple mistake, as if he had used the term “gay” to refer to a heterosexual relationship.

So can Lia be whatever she chooses?

Atlanticmike wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 4:22 pm

Res Ipsa wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 4:15 pm

No, I don’t believe that “biological women” or “cis women” exist. Lia exists. The human mind has created many categories and labels we could apply to her. Those do not “exist” — at least not in the way Lia does.

None of these labels should be mistaken for Lia. None of them give a complete description of who she is. They are mental constructs that help our brains understand the world and that facilitate communication. But they can do the latter only if we assign the same meaning to the label.

So, my comment to Moksha has nothing to do with existence. It simply clarified how a specific label, “Transgender,” is used. What he did was a simple mistake, as if he had used the term “gay” to refer to a heterosexual relationship.

So can Lia be whatever she chooses?

It isn't a choice. Transgenderism is a neurological condition since birth. Lia is what she is. A female. Dogmatically asserting the opposite comes across as ignorant and transphobic.

But why does it bother you so much she would get to decide about her own identity, and not Tucker Carlson?

Atlanticmike wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 4:22 pm

Res Ipsa wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 24, 2022 4:15 pm

No, I don’t believe that “biological women” or “cis women” exist. Lia exists. The human mind has created many categories and labels we could apply to her. Those do not “exist” — at least not in the way Lia does.

None of these labels should be mistaken for Lia. None of them give a complete description of who she is. They are mental constructs that help our brains understand the world and that facilitate communication. But they can do the latter only if we assign the same meaning to the label.

So, my comment to Moksha has nothing to do with existence. It simply clarified how a specific label, “Transgender,” is used. What he did was a simple mistake, as if he had used the term “gay” to refer to a heterosexual relationship.

So can Lia be whatever she chooses?

Again, I think you're confusing labels with people. Lia is a person. Her existence has nothing to do with labels and categories we have constructed. You and I can discuss or debate whether a particular category or label is appropriately applied to Lia. For example, "rock" and "eagle" are well-defined labels that I think we would agree would not apply to Lia. But the labels and categories don't have anything to do with what or who she "is."

There are thousands of labels and categories that potentially apply to Lia. They aren't mutually exclusive and none of them completely tell us who or what she is. "Biological female" is a human constructed category. You can point to a person that falls within the definition of that category, but you can't point to "Biological female." And, given that around half the population of the world falls within that category, it doesn't convey much information about who or what a person that falls within that category "is."