Coping With Grief - Where are you?

[_wenglund]

I'm not one of those who felt a deep loss on finding out Mormonism is a fraud. Rather, it was extremely liberating. Realizing that I did not have to feel inadequate for my inability to believe in superstitious crap was like a tremendous lifting of a heavy load.

Now back to the subject. I do not find comfort in trite cliches; nor do I feel comfortable spouting them. My parents' time on earth is coming to a close, and perhaps quickly. When it happens, my preference would be for people simply to be there, let me know they are there to help if I want or need it, and let me grieve in my own way and in silence. I don't want comforting words. I don't want promises of happy reunions (in which I don't believe). I don't want all the things that people say that sound so superficial and trite (although not meaning them to sound so). Express your condolences, and let me be, and let me know you're there. That's enough.

And, please, please, please do not see this as a missionary opportunity to preach to me about the Plan of Salvation.

What I tend to find extremely liberating and burden-lifting, is when I succeed in not make things all about me and what I want, even upon the death of my parents. This way I am not poised to be offended or ill-affected regardless of what people may say or do, particularly when they are striving to be loving and comforting.

But, I can understand if people may see things differently.

a while back I attended the funeral of a close relation in which the Baptist minister conducting the services had tailored a portion of his speech to the LDS family members in attendance (including myself), intimating the need to become true Christians, and "saved", so as to not end up in hell. I suppose we LDS could have felt slighted and indignant, but we chose instead to view those actions in understanding and respectful ways, and to also keep our thoughts focused tenderly on the close relation we had just lost. This prevented divisiveness during a time when togetherness was most needed. Instead of coldness and animus interjected into the situation, there was an increase of warmth and love--for which I was very happy.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_keene]

Keene, I hope your life stays on the up and up and you never do have to grieve. :) My blog was not dealing with my past - it was dealing with my current. Before the last few months I woke up with a 'hurrah' on my breath and a skip in my step. Yep, I got whooped bad emotionally in the last few months. My past didn't whip me! I lived my past. I have NO shame or problems with the life I've lived. My blog was trying to come to terms of WHERE I AM NOW! And why I was so impacted by the current. I am a strong woman. I've dealt with plenty in my life and it made me an incredibly strong person. My weakness came from the current state of my life. I had to work through that.

I have a lot of character flaws. I don't consider wallowing for a month to be one of them. ;P

My life has its ups and downs, just like everyone else, and I do have the tendency to 'wallow' a bit, but I catch myself doing way more than is necessary far too often. I have this subconsious belief that I will be loved and cared for if I just make my life miserable. My first relationship was based entirely around that premise, and it was awful. I also found that I got praised when I said I was feeling crappy, but if I was feeling alright, I was reprimanded for not doing better.

So, grief tends to be a habit in me -- one that I greatly dislike, and one that probably holds me back more than any other emotion.

One of the things I've come to learn recently (learned in theory, still working on it in practice) is that /everything/ happens in the past. By the time you're even aware enough of it to think about it, it's in the past. In the present, there is only joy.

So, the way I try and deal with things in the present, is I use various NLP techniques to make even the most immediate things feel like it happened weeks ago. I try and put myself in a state of mind where I've already learned the lesson from whatever grief I would have experienced, and I look back on the situation with a more wise self, and laugh the same way I laugh at issues I had years ago. Depending on the strength of the emotion, it has varying levels of success -- but then, I haven't practiced these particular methods much before, and it gets easier to do each time.

I hope you know my last post wasn't meant to be personally directed or anything -- just my thoughts on grief. :)

[_guy sajer]

I'm not one of those who felt a deep loss on finding out Mormonism is a fraud. Rather, it was extremely liberating. Realizing that I did not have to feel inadequate for my inability to believe in superstitious crap was like a tremendous lifting of a heavy load.

Now back to the subject. I do not find comfort in trite cliches; nor do I feel comfortable spouting them. My parents' time on earth is coming to a close, and perhaps quickly. When it happens, my preference would be for people simply to be there, let me know they are there to help if I want or need it, and let me grieve in my own way and in silence. I don't want comforting words. I don't want promises of happy reunions (in which I don't believe). I don't want all the things that people say that sound so superficial and trite (although not meaning them to sound so). Express your condolences, and let me be, and let me know you're there. That's enough.

And, please, please, please do not see this as a missionary opportunity to preach to me about the Plan of Salvation.

What I tend to find extremely liberating and burden-lifting, is when I succeed in not make things all about me and what I want, even upon the death of my parents. This way I am not poised to be offended or ill-affected regardless of what people may say or do, particularly when they are striving to be loving and comforting.

But, I can understand if people may see things differently.

Nice backhanded, passive-aggressive insult Wade.

If I recall, the topic was on grief and how we deal with it. Some may think that discussing how a person deals with grief might require . . . oh let's say, a reference or two to the person in question.

[_harmony]

I'm not one of those who felt a deep loss on finding out Mormonism is a fraud. Rather, it was extremely liberating. Realizing that I did not have to feel inadequate for my inability to believe in superstitious crap was like a tremendous lifting of a heavy load.

Now back to the subject. I do not find comfort in trite cliches; nor do I feel comfortable spouting them. My parents' time on earth is coming to a close, and perhaps quickly. When it happens, my preference would be for people simply to be there, let me know they are there to help if I want or need it, and let me grieve in my own way and in silence. I don't want comforting words. I don't want promises of happy reunions (in which I don't believe). I don't want all the things that people say that sound so superficial and trite (although not meaning them to sound so). Express your condolences, and let me be, and let me know you're there. That's enough.

And, please, please, please do not see this as a missionary opportunity to preach to me about the Plan of Salvation.

When my brother in law was electrocuted, the neighborhood was devastated. He was so young. And then he was dead. One neighbor came over to our house one night, sat in our living room staring at the floor holding his hat for quite some time, rose and laid a hand on my husband's shoulder, and left. He never said a word. It was the most comforting visit we had during that whole ordeal.

There is something to be said for being present and silent, in times of grief.

[_wenglund]

Nice backhanded, passive-aggressive insult Wade.

If I recall, the topic was on grief and how we deal with it. Some may think that discussing how a person deals with grief might require . . . oh let's say, a reference or two to the person in question.

I am not sure how my benignly intimating what is liberating to ME somehow got turned around in your mind as an insult of YOU. It certainly wasn't intended by me to be interpreted in that way. Could it be that you are still somewhat burdened with taking things too personally (i.e. ironically making things "all about you") and reading things into what others say? Could you be projecting your propensity to insult (particularly believers) onto me? I don't know, but I ask because, while I was initially tempted to return your unmistakable insult of my faith with an insult of you, I intentionally chose not to since learning of the counterproductivity of that kind of tit-for-tat.

And, of course in discussions on how we personally may deal with grief it would be expected that we personally would be referenced and the subject of what we say. That was certainly the case with my post--where the subject was obviously ME (though you misinterpreted it as being about YOU).

But, at least in my mind, there is a critical difference between me making me the subject of my post, and me making things "all about me". With the latter, the "me" is not only the subjest, but also the object of my concern or wishes. For example, if I say "I want to make others happy", then I have made ME the subject, but OTHERS the object of happiness, whereas, were I to say "I want others to make me happy", then I have made ME the subject, and ME the object of happiness. In other words I have made things "all about ME". Do you see the difference?

While readily acknowledging that others may see it differently, and respecting this (not to be confused with insulting others), I personally have found it liberating and burden-lifting to make myself less the object of my attentions when grieving along with others, though still making myself at times the subject of the same. In other words, I find it helpful for ME, when grieving, to be mindful and attentive of the needs of OTHERS, rather than focusing solely on MY needs and wants.

I hope this clarification has been of some help.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Nephi]

I always get stuck in self attacking, to the point that it seriously harms myself and those around me. When I fail, and others are affected by it, I get feelings of self worthlessness and semi-suicidal thoughts. Its almost all I can do to keep those thoughts at bay, for there is no good that comes from them.

For, easily, 2 years now, we have struggled as a family to make ends meet and push on through. We are in a desperate race to get one of the two of us through college that we might better ourselves on the other side (hope that actually happens). Depression is a constant thing that I battle to keep at bay, or at least on the down low. Not only is it harmful, but it sometimes is so great, it affects my wife and kids, and I know my wife has issues as well with what we are going through as a family right now. Recently, I am just becoming numb, because there isn't much I can do to alieviate (sp?) the situation. We just have to wait it out.

[_gramps]

Wade wrote to Guy Sajer:

I am not sure how my benignly intimating what is liberating to ME somehow got turned around in your mind as an insult of YOU. It certainly wasn't intended by me to be interpreted in that way. Could it be that you are still somewhat burdened with taking things too personally (I.e. ironically making things "all about you") and reading things into what others say? Could you be projecting your propensity to insult (particularly believers) onto me? I don't know, but I ask because, while I was initially tempted to return your unmistakable insult of my faith with an insult of you, I intentionally chose not to since learning of the counterproductivity of that kind of tit-for-tat.

Wade, I believe I have never posted once to you, though I may have and don't remember.

From the first time I read your posts here on this board, I have thought you are one of the biggest liars I've ever come across.

Just to let you know, you are not worth the time of day. And I won't post again to you. But, I finally decided I would say something about what I see with you. I personally don't think you have conned yourself into believing what you post. I think you do it fully consciously, which makes you a big liar.

Good day, Wade (the counselor)

[_KimberlyAnn]

I always get stuck in self attacking, to the point that it seriously harms myself and those around me. When I fail, and others are affected by it, I get feelings of self worthlessness and semi-suicidal thoughts. Its almost all I can do to keep those thoughts at bay, for there is no good that comes from them.

For, easily, 2 years now, we have struggled as a family to make ends meet and push on through. We are in a desperate race to get one of the two of us through college that we might better ourselves on the other side (hope that actually happens). Depression is a constant thing that I battle to keep at bay, or at least on the down low. Not only is it harmful, but it sometimes is so great, it affects my wife and kids, and I know my wife has issues as well with what we are going through as a family right now. Recently, I am just becoming numb, because there isn't much I can do to alieviate (sp?) the situation. We just have to wait it out.

Nephi, I'm so sorry you're having a hard time right now and that you're feeling depressed. :(

KA

[_mormonmistress]

For, easily, 2 years now, we have struggled as a family to make ends meet and push on through. We are in a desperate race to get one of the two of us through college that we might better ourselves on the other side (hope that actually happens). Depression is a constant thing that I battle to keep at bay, or at least on the down low. Not only is it harmful, but it sometimes is so great, it affects my wife and kids, and I know my wife has issues as well with what we are going through as a family right now. Recently, I am just becoming numb, because there isn't much I can do to alieviate (sp?) the situation. We just have to wait it out.

Stick with the college and it will happen. I've been where you are, desperately poor, with outgoings significantly higher than incomings, trying to study to better my situation for my child. It took me 7 years to get from there to where I am now and I have just bought my own home. I thought it would never happen many times, but kept taking one step at a time and eventually achieved my goal. Try to not look too far ahead, except for when you visualise your goal. Get through each day and each hurdle in isolation. Celebrate every little success and the little things in life that bring you joy. Every time you pass an exam, pay a bill, get through another day, you are edging ever closer. Hang in there and look for the little things to keep you smiling. Kids are often great for this.

[_wenglund]

I always get stuck in self attacking, to the point that it seriously harms myself and those around me. When I fail, and others are affected by it, I get feelings of self worthlessness and semi-suicidal thoughts. Its almost all I can do to keep those thoughts at bay, for there is no good that comes from them.

For, easily, 2 years now, we have struggled as a family to make ends meet and push on through. We are in a desperate race to get one of the two of us through college that we might better ourselves on the other side (hope that actually happens). Depression is a constant thing that I battle to keep at bay, or at least on the down low. Not only is it harmful, but it sometimes is so great, it affects my wife and kids, and I know my wife has issues as well with what we are going through as a family right now. Recently, I am just becoming numb, because there isn't much I can do to alieviate (sp?) the situation. We just have to wait it out.

I am not sure what resources you may have available to you, but I have found cognitive behavioral therapy to be of immense help in usuaging depression. And, if you can 't afford to see a CBT therapist, there are books that you can purchase or check out in the library that can be used to self-help. Dr. Greenburg's book on "Mind Over Mood" is great and so is Dr. Burns' book on "Feeling Good". if that is of any help to you. I know first-hand how debilitating depression can be, and I would love to see you and your family get at least some relief.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-