Racism vs Culturism and White guilt vs White peacemakers

[Analytics]

Is it still racism if you think black Americans are lazy, but think that black Africans are hard workers?

Is it still white guilt if you don't think you've done anything wrong to black Americans but you think it's important to go the extra mile to support them in order to build better race relations?


As an aside, if someone is accused of bigotry toward group X (gays, women, or blacks) why is it that they often respond by talking about how many _____ friends they have?

[_bcspace]

Is it still racism if you think black Americans are lazy, but think that black Africans are hard workers?

No. But I don't think that anyway. One of my missionary companions from Kenya often commented on the differences between America's ghetto culture (which he wholly rejected) and European and African black cultures. I agreed with him.

Is it still white guilt if you don't think you've done anything wrong to black Americans but you think it's important to go the extra mile to support them in order to build better race relations?

Yes.

As an aside, if someone is accused of bigotry toward group X (gays, women, or blacks) that they often respond by talking about how many _____ friends they have?

????

[_antishock8]

Is it still racism if you think black Americans are lazy, but think that black Africans are hard workers?

It's not racism in either case. It's just an opinion or perhaps bigotry, or prejudice if you don't have any extensive experience upon which to base your opinion. It's only racism once you think the entire Black race is inferior to your race for whatever reasons. I think it's weird how people have confused words and their meanings. It muddles up the issue completely.

What's sad is that having legitimate experiences with people of other races, religions, or creeds are summarily dismissed as somehow being one's own shortcoming.

I have strong opinions about Mormons that I formed through extensive contact. Some people get it. Others don't. Some would say I'm a bigot, and others would think I'm reasonable considering what I experienced.

I have strong opinions about Black, White, Brown, and Asian peoples. Why? Because that's a natural response to interacting with others. If we were never able to form an opinion about anything, develop stereotypes, etc.. We wouldn't make it long enough to reproduce. It's not a bad thing to develop opinions about groups. Sometimes it helps to serve and protect your own interests.

The idea that because I'm White I'm a racist or bigoted if I have a negative opinion about a group of people is, in of itself, offensive. You're essentially asking me to remain willfully ignorant of others and how they affect me. I'm not going to do it. That's ridiculous.

Is it still white guilt if you don't think you've done anything wrong to black Americans but you think it's important to go the extra mile to support them in order to build better race relations?

No. That's being retarded. You continue to infantalize an entire segment of the population. They then can't adapt to real-world demands of expediency, professionalism, and conduct in a general sense. It is actually YOUR fault for THEIR shortcoming if you keep giving them a hand up.

in my opinion, make everything equal. Period. Men, women, white, brown... Doesn't matter. Make it equal. No legal discrimination. Promotion through merit, not because you're black, have dick, or whatever. But, you'll never get rid of discrimination. Ever. Even under a system that designed to abolish it, discrimination will find a way. It's human nature. So that leads us to life challenges.

You have to remember, people choose how to react to their circumstances. No one will ever get everything they want, with the handful of exceptions. How one reacts to that reality will determine if they have a meaningful life. No one tells a parent to not educate his or her child. But if the parent has been infantalized his whole life he won't see a reason to rise above his situation because he doesn't need to do it. His needs are being met. It's easier just to chill out and bitch about the lack of "justice". That's BS.

[_Some Schmo]

What's sad is that having legitimate experiences with people of other races, religions, or creeds are summarily dismissed as somehow being one's own shortcoming.

I have strong opinions about Mormons that I formed through extensive contact. Some people get it. Others don't. Some would say I'm a bigot, and others would think I'm reasonable considering what I experienced.

I have strong opinions about Black, White, Brown, and Asian peoples. Why? Because that's a natural response to interacting with others. If we were never able to form an opinion about anything, develop stereotypes, etc.. We wouldn't make it long enough to reproduce. It's not a bad thing to develop opinions about groups. Sometimes it helps to serve and protect your own interests.

Here's the problem with what you're saying: it's all about "groups" as opposed to say "cultures." You're making an assessment based on a group of people based on something that has nothing to do with their character, whether they really self identify with that group or not.

It would be one thing if you were saying, "I have so and so problem with culture x." In that case, you're making a judgment based on a particular way of thinking, and I think that's somewhat valid. It separates the thought processes and beliefs from the individuals, so that you aren't attributing the behavior to the race of people, but the thought process. As soon as you say, "This race thinks this way, or does this, or is this way" you automatically fail, because there are bound to be numerous exceptions.

I'll never forget something my 9th grade English teacher told us one day. He started the lesson saying, "Today, we're going to build a fail proof BS detector!" (We were all amazed he actually swore in class). "Any time you hear words that are absolutes, like 'always', 'never', 'every', 'all', or 'none' in a sentence, you can write that statement off as BS!" In other words, generalizations are generally BS.

You can find examples of all kinds of behavior in all kinds of people. When you try to make the case that one type of people are more apt to certain behaviors based on the color of their skin... well, you're full of crap. It's intellectually dishonest and bigoted. There's just no getting around it, man, not matter how much you try to rationalize.

[_antishock8]

If you live your life free of stereotypes, and that works for you then congrats. I don't think you do. I don't think you can. I think it's human nature to develop an opinion about "cultures", groups, nations, creeds, religions, etc.. It's what we do. It's human nature. What's not natural, in fact, it's wholly unnatural to go around with a "free and open mind" individually judging everyone based on their uniqueness and individuality.

That's a recipe for disaster. Man.

For example:

That growling pit bull/rottweiler mix, frothing at the mouth, muscles tensed, ears laid back probably doesn't want me to approach it and try to pet it.

I don't know its character. But I do know that his kinds of breed have reputations for being aggressive. From past experience with dogs if they're growling, frothing at the mouth, muscles tense, ears laid back it generally means don't go near it. In fact, it means go away.

I've pre-judged that dog. I don't know the first fuckin' thing about that dog, really.

But I'm being bigoted, right? I mean. It COULD be a nice dog. It COULD a great family dog. It COULD learn tricks. It COULD be the greatest dog ever. MAYBE it just needs some affection. MAYBE it really just wants to play with me.

In your world, I feel guilty for pre-judging that dog, and go up and attempt to pet it.

In my world, I avoid it.

Interacting with peope is no different. We form opinions off information we've gathered. While admirable, you manner of approaching the world seems irresponsible and willfully ignorant. I prefer my manner. Respect is earned, not given. Period.

[_Some Schmo]

Interacting with peope is no different. We form opinions off information we've gathered. While admirable, you manner of approaching the world seems irresponsible and willfully ignorant. I prefer my manner. Respect is earned, not given. Period.

There's no need to convince me that you feel justified being a bigot. I get it.

[_antishock8]

Interacting with peope is no different. We form opinions off information we've gathered. While admirable, you manner of approaching the world seems irresponsible and willfully ignorant. I prefer my manner. Respect is earned, not given. Period.

There's no need to convince me that you feel justified being a bigot. I get it.

Your mind was already made up. Luckily I don't care if you think I'm a bigot. I think you're a know-nothing idiot filled with baseless opinions.

[_Some Schmo]

There's no need to convince me that you feel justified being a bigot. I get it.

Your mind was already made up. Luckily I don't care if you think I'm a bigot. I think you're a know-nothing dip**** filled with baseless opinions.

Actually, I had no opinion until you started talking about it. I don't think about you much.

And the instrument has yet to be invented to measure the indifference I have to your opinion of me.

But just so I have this straight: you don't care what I think, but now you think I'm a "know-nothing dip**** filled with baseless opinions?" That's quite a bit of emotion for something you don't care about.

Pretty funny paragraph right there.

[_Dr. Shades]

As an aside, if someone is accused of bigotry toward group X (gays, women, or blacks) that they often respond by talking about how many _____ friends they have?

??? You left off the last half of that question. Care to re-word?

[_asbestosman]

??? You left off the last half of that question. Care to re-word?

Fixored