DiscussMormonism.com

1. They have done nothing wrong.
2. They are here because of their parents.
3. They can not be sent back.
4. Why don't they deserve your amnesty?

Yeah, like, how can these pro-dreamer types insist on inserting Dreamers into subby's abdomen, forcing him to carry them inside him to sustain their life, and then forcing him to give birth to them against his will.

Oh, they're not?

Nevermind.

Blasocysts aren't people.

sub it's for a variety of reasons that women choose to terminate a pregnancy. Study up on those and get back to us, because in spite of the fact that I think that's a pretty powerful presentation you made, the answers and reasons aren't as simple as that.

EA stop with the blastocysts aren't people crap already. He's presented an ultrasound image of a 12+week fetus.

EAllusion wrote:Blasocysts aren't people.

Precisely. And we know the fetus is not "dreaming."

Jersey Girl wrote:sub it's for a variety of reasons that women choose to terminate a pregnancy. Study up on those and get back to us, because in spite of the fact that I think that's a pretty powerful presentation you made, the answers and reasons aren't as simple as that.

EA stop with the blastocysts aren't people crap already. He's presented an ultrasound image of a 12+week fetus.

He was offering a flippant argument and got a flippant response. There was nothing "powerful" about his presentation. Obviously people who disagree with his pro-life positioning but support path to citizenship for dreamers believe that there are morally significant differences between the two. The personhood status of fetuses, or rather the lack of it, is central to pro-choice arguments that dominate moral philosophy. If he wants to make his argument about why fetuses are people and why bodily property rights arguments are wrong, he can, but then it reduces into a standard argument over abortion and has precisely nothing to do with the current immigration debate. The attempt to point out hypocrisy is childish. It's also almost certainly trolling, and you probably shouldn't feel great about finding intentional idiocy to be a serious argument.

subgenius wrote:1. They have done nothing wrong.
2. They are here because of their parents.
3. They can not be sent back.
4. Why don't they deserve your amnesty?

Thought provoking - No matter where you happen to stand on abortion.

Peace,
Ceeboo

sub I have to admit that I partially act on personal bias whenever I see men discussing this issue. Not one of you has ever conceived nor will you ever fully experience the plight women who have discovered they are unintentionally pregnant or faced the myriad of issues that women face in making decisions.

If you find a way to mandate abstinence, let me know. Until then, you need to face the fact that some women don't use contraception, contraceptives fail, men fail women, and sometimes women fail themselves. We've got (mainly) the religious right talking out both sides of it's mouth and wanting to wipe out both ETOP and women's access to contraceptives via Planned Parenthood, some businesses wanting to deny their female employees coverage for contraception under their health coverage plans, while at the same time doing little or nothing to make adoption an easy process to navigate. Although I am pro-life and also pro-choice, what we shouldn't want for women is taking a step back into back alley clinics or taking things into their own hands in their bathrooms or throwing themselves down flights of stairs, and give them the right to make their own decisions without interference from others.

As for the Dreamers, some folks are simply hypocrites. They were children who were brought into this country by their parents. So it's kind of odd to see a person like you raise up the issue pro-life when you essentially portray yourself as wanting to allow the unborn to be born into this world and you likely have no desire to help the Dreamers who already were.

What the hell is it that some folks really want? The right to dictate the lives of others?

I say we try to come through for as many folks (Dreamers, the unborn, women and men who face unplanned pregnancy) via education and support as we possibly can, because that before all else, is the right and moral thing to do.

Oh dear............... Kevin, that was really awkward!

Please don't attempt that ever again! It was not clever - or funny - or witty - It was actually a little disturbing. Leave the gif contributions to the experts.

Just be you Kevin - stick to long political rants - gifs ain't yo thing, displays of bigotry and intolerance is..... bro.