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Should the Senate Republicans argue for the exoneration of Trump based on Rudy Guiliani taking advantage of the both dementia and criminal tendencies of his client?

Don't know about a final exoneration, but Republicans could make a very substantial case for Trump's diminished mental capacity and a prima facie case for Trump's criminal tendencies.

moksha wrote:Should the Senate Republicans argue for the exoneration of Trump based on Rudy Guiliani taking advantage of the both dementia and criminal tendencies of his client?

That seems to me an incredibly stupid line of defense. Whether that defense succeeds or fails, it looks very bad for Trump, because if that line of defense succeeds, how can they then turn around and oppose obligatory use of the 25th Amendment to remove Trump from office?

Besides that, is there any likelihood that Trump would even go along with being publicly labeled as demented and/or criminally inclined, if that it is what it takes to survive an impeachment trial?

moksha wrote:Don't know about a final exoneration, but Republicans could make a very substantial case for Trump's diminished mental capacity and a prima facie case for Trump's criminal tendencies.

That may be true, but it would still make him unqualified for public office of any kind, let alone President. It may save him from criminal prosecution and conviction after leaving office, however. Would Trump ever resign himself to that being the best he can hope for?

Gunnar wrote:Would Trump ever resign himself to that being the best he can hope for?

As long as Trump is making money off his position as President, he will be able to suck it up. Having his mental status and criminal tendencies highlighted will only serve to energize his base, putting him one step closer to reelection.

When I think of the Republican reticence to back the President's impeachment, I think of MLK's observation: The arc of history is long, but it bends toward justice.

How does this relate? Well, Republicans are justifiably worried about being voted out of office by GOP voters, unless there is a dramatic shift in Republican polling. So the short term survival strategy will be to vote against impeachment. Truth is slipping off the deep end. Today Sarah Sanders said the Trump reads more than any other person she knows, which begs the question: Who is her circle of friends?

But on the other side of that vote is the Constitution and the conduct of Donald Trump. And as more and more information about Trump comes out in subsequent hearings in Washington, The State of New York, the Southern District of New York, the cumulative weight of history will reflect more and more negatively against Donald Trump, and the quislings that enabled him.

As for the rationalization being that we are too close to the 2020 election, just remember the this impeachment revolves around Trump using leverage with military funds to try and get dirt on Joe Biden, to influence the 2020 election. So the response of the country should be to wait for the election he was trying to rig? Call it 'No harm, no foul'? I think not.

To paraphrase Fiona Hill, it's all going to blow up in their faces.

MeDotOrg wrote:To paraphrase Fiona Hill, it's all going to blow up in their faces.

Not necessarily, when Republicans live in an alternate reality, with an alternate set of data and physics. Such a blow up might actually be a good thing in that reality. What may appear to us to be deceptive and venal might seem to them to be wholesome and normal.

moksha wrote:Republicans live in an alternate reality, with an alternate set of data and physics.

To demonstrate the alternative reality of Republicans, consider that 53% of them believe that Trump is a better President than Lincoln.

When asked why Republicans pointed to Lincoln backing the North in the Civil War, and also mentioned that Trump gave a much larger tax cut to the rich than Lincoln.

moksha wrote:To demonstrate the alternative reality of Republicans, consider that 53% of them believe that Trump is a better President than Lincoln.

Ha. From Honest Old Abe to Dishonest Dumb Donald.

A bit of a come-down for a once great party. no?

moksha wrote:

moksha wrote:Republicans live in an alternate reality, with an alternate set of data and physics.

To demonstrate the alternative reality of Republicans, consider that 53% of them believe that Trump is a better President than Lincoln.

When asked why Republicans pointed to Lincoln backing the North in the Civil War, and also mentioned that Trump gave a much larger tax cut to the rich than Lincoln.

In fairness, that ends up being, what?, 15% of adults? That's sub-geocentrism numbers.